France

[triquet]

As we have aplace in France, we do quite a lot of driving over there. We're quite aware of the legal differences, things like speed limits, priorite a droite, stuff that you need in the car etc, but I'm intrigued by the different driving culture.

One of the more obvious things is what we would call the progress imperative. Mr Frenchman will always try to overtake, sometimes at great risk to life and limb, particurly at 1205 when he is rushing home for lunch and at 1355 when he is rushing back after lunch. I'm sure the accident statistics must peak round about then.

The other oddity is the the way they position on roundabouts: they tend to dribble right round the outside of a roundabout even if going round to 9-oclock. Indication on roundabouts is completely random: take no notice they could do anything and probably will.

On dual carriageways / motorways if they want to overtake a string of slower vehicles, they'll keep the left indicator on. I quite like this, and it does give clear intent. And they indicate to go back in again.

Anybody got any other observations?

[jont]

They don't get hung up about people who do want to overtake.

In general, traffic density is much lower than the UK.

Coupled with their in general better attitude to overtaking, you don't tend to get long convoys on main single carriageway roads that the UK suffers from.

If you take an interesting car (eg Lotus), you tend to get a much friendlier reception than you would in the UK passing through villages etc.

[TheInsanity1234]

Have never been to Europe outside of Euro-Disney.

However, from frequent Top-Gear watching, I can see that in Germany, there's a culture of "get out of my way, nincompoop!" on the motorways.

One thing I like especially is when they're about to overtake a car, they put their main beam on for a few seconds as if to say "Don't move out, I'm coming past"

But I think the indicating left while overtaking would only be of use on D/C, unless in the outside lane on the motorway.

[MGF]

On the continent generally i find that overtaking is a social activity. People are willing to help. In the UK it is more of an anti-social activity with people more willing to hinder.

[TheInsanity1234]

On the continent generally i find that overtaking is a social activity. People are willing to help. In the UK it is more of an anti-social activity with people more willing to hinder.

Bang.

On.

[true blue]

In my experience, the French drive a lot closer on the motorways - they'll come within a car length before pulling out to overtake, and will pull in again almost immediately after overtaking. Not so good for separation, but it seems to be understood by all.

On single carriageways, while they are more willing to overtake than typical UK drivers, they're also much less concerned about making sure it's safe to do so. Last time I was over there, I had an oncoming car pull out for the overtake some 3-4s away from me at my cruising pace. I was forced to brake hard, and even then it wasn't what I'd call a comfortable gap.

On balance, I think that while the attitude towards cooperation and progress are better than in the UK, the standard overall is lower, sometimes dangerously so. If you're driving over there, take care with long range observations, and try to anticipate the mad overtakes/offsiding before it becomes an imminent danger!

As for Germany, I'd take anything on Top Gear with a large pinch of salt. It's an entertainment programme, not a documentary. Reinforcing national stereotypes and playing the fool are what's made it so popular!

[Kimosabe]

The reason none of our cars have ever been involved in a collision is because I drive them and not my French missus. Her words, not mine.

I would never assume a French driver has anything close to a plan that extends beyond 'must be infront' especially around lunchtime and I always treat them all with utter contempt, not because they're French but because of their cultural values when it comes to driving. They are taught to drive to an equally high standard as uk drivers and then they bin it in favour of Nintendo driving. I treat driving in France like a game of chess and always do my best to ensure that I know where the next ridiculous move is coming from.

Had a bloke in a van undertake me by driving onto a pavement in a busy town centre, just because he wanted to assert 'priority a droite' for a hundred yards beyond the junction in a one way system. What I have found is that some 'rules' are conveniently asserted when it suits the French driver and that when driving my sister-in-laws car, such incidents are no less frequent.

My advice is that anyone considering driving in France either considers joining the local way of doing things in favour of abiding by laws, because you'll get no mercy if you don't or that they take it really easy and with a reduced expectation of reasonable behaviour from other motorists.

Our nephew is now a Gendarme and he has put us straight on 'how it works' from their perspective; still drives like a Twoccing chav though.

It's still a big and very beautiful country and it's not all one big driving drama, as long as you don't rely too heavily on a satnav.

[Horse]

One thing I like especially is when they're about to overtake a car, they put their main beam on for a few seconds as if to say "Don't move out, I'm coming past"

Back in Ye Olden Days of early-ish Japanese motorcycles (late 1970s), the high beam flasher switch was usually/often/sometimes (I only ever rode a few of them! ) labelled as the 'passing' light.

[TheInsanity1234]

One thing I like especially is when they're about to overtake a car, they put their main beam on for a few seconds as if to say "Don't move out, I'm coming past"

Back in Ye Olden Days of early-ish Japanese motorcycles (late 1970s), the high beam flasher switch was usually/often/sometimes (I only ever rode a few of them! ) labelled as the 'passing' light.

It might not make a difference to those drivers who are going to pull out and "f*ck you all, I'm going where I want!" but it might make a difference to those who look in the mirror and just didn't register that a car is approaching because they might be day dreaming or distracted by an emotional event, such as the death of a loved one, etc.

[Carbon Based]

We've racked up a fair few holiday miles in France, Spain and Italy.

This biggest difference in drivers is that, er, there aren't any. Well, it seems like there are very few drivers about once you cross the channel, and avoid the cities.

I like the "I'm overtaking therefore I'm indicating" habit. Makes it a positive action.

The other thing I notice, is there seems to be much more affinity to small, old semi agricultural vans - epitomised by the three wheeled Italian ones that I think are based on a moped.

Now the most extreme regional variation we've seen would be around the Amalfi Coast. You should go. But not in your own car. If you remember a Peugeot advert from a few years ago where a young chap hammers an old banger in to shape of a new 107.

Well, around those parts they hammer old bangers until they have the shape of new Audi, BMW & Mercs. You then look closer and realise that they ARE new Audi, BMW & Mercs but with every corner bashed in. Seems the narrow, twisty roads cut out of the cliff, and an "I've got the road to myself" attitude means minor bumps are expected and not worth fixing because it will just happen again tomorrow.

Beautiful scenery though.

[sussex2]

On the continent generally i find that overtaking is a social activity. People are willing to help. In the UK it is more of an anti-social activity with people more willing to hinder.

You almost always get 'thanked' by motorcyclists if you indicate right or otherwise allow them an opportunity to pass - a leg out is the usual.

[sussex2]

I've driven more miles than I care to think about on the mainland. If I added them up it would probably be at least equal to the ones I have driven in the UK and most probably more.
I am a very even tempered driver and rarely voice my disapproval of others actions. It really doesn't look good from a professional driver to do so.
However being one who makes a study of behaviour some things bemuse me.
The french method of motorway driving being one:
I call it 'coffin driving' as they will drive themselves into a box and be surrounded by other vehicles. It only takes one mistake and down comes the lid!
On the plus side they seem quite happy to be trapped behind a vehicle they could have pulled around easily.
Why do they do this? I think it may be because by and large it takes about 50 years to change attitudes and that is how they conducted themselves before the autoroutes came about.
There will be parallels in the way people drive in the UK; old attitudes and habits that have failed the test of time.

[Mike H]

Having just returned from a couple of weeks in France, one thing that did strike me on this trip, bearing in mind it's only been a few months since we were last there, was that overtaking on single carriageway roads seemed much more restrained than usual, almost 'hesitant'. On several occasions on long straight D roads, with good visibility, following drivers missed what I deemed ample opportunities to overtake. Not so on the autoroutes(!), but we both commented about how different it seemed. Almost as if the French government had been running an 'overtake with extreme caution' ad campaign

[jont]

Having just returned from a couple of weeks in France, one thing that did strike me on this trip, bearing in mind it's only been a few months since we were last there, was that overtaking on single carriageway roads seemed much more restrained than usual, almost 'hesitant'. On several occasions on long straight D roads, with good visibility, following drivers missed what I deemed ample opportunities to overtake. Not so on the autoroutes(!), but we both commented about how different it seemed. Almost as if the French government had been running an 'overtake with extreme caution' ad campaign

I think they have, only it's branded as an anti-speeding campaign with some exceptionally heavy penalties.

[martine]

So I'm near Bordeaux as I write this with the family on a 2 week hols. Quite agree with Triquet about closeness on motorways - they nearly all do it both before and after the overtake which is a little disconcerting and outright dangerous.

Still confused about the priority to the right rules...the French seem to have got themselves in a bit of a pickle with:

• 'diamond' signs (you're on a priority route)
• cancelled 'diamond' signs (no longer on a priority route)
• 'Cedez Le Passage' sign (give way)
• 'Priorité à droite' sign (priority to the right)
• the Cross road sign (which isn't necessarily a cross-roads) which also means priority to the right
• "Vous n'avez pas la priorité" sign (you don't have priority)

All very confusing.