What car?

[Silk]

Not wishing to be a boring old killjoy but the C4 VTS is a powerful car for a novice driver...might be best to hone your skills, do an AD course and then reward yourself with it then?

To disagree, I'd have put it as, hone your skills by doing an AD course, then you should be capable of driving anything you can afford to insure.

That's the theory. In practice, AD training is only part of the picture. You can't ignore experience and maturity. Although "Insanity" shows wisdom beyond his years, he's still a young man at the end of the day. Probably best to get something cheap and cheerful. Then, if you get in a scrape, it's no big deal.

[I do assume that our Insanity will then abide by what is meant by AD.

I'm sure he'll do his best. Not always easy for any of us. Even harder when you have an eager car and youthful exuberance to tempt you.

[fungus]

I arived at a pupils house yesterday evening to see a brand spanking new 1.2 Corsa on the drive. She'd saved her money and gone for new. The upside is that the car should be more trouble free and safer than one of six or seven years old. The downside is that it cost many more notes, and as Silk said, if you scrape it you'll feel worse about it than scraping an older car.

As Martin said, a Citroen C4 VTS is quite a powerfull car for a seventeen year old novice driver. The insurance quotes you are getting seem very low to me, and I would expect a Citroen C4 to be in excess of £2.5k per anum, and a VTS considerably more.

[WhoseGeneration]

I'm sure he'll do his best. Not always easy for any of us. Even harder when you have an eager car and youthful exuberance to tempt you.

My point, which I'm sure applies to all of us here, it's that nagging at the back of one's mind, am I abiding by the tenets of AD?

Better to have those instilled earlier rather than after an "event". Well, I would have benefitted and I'd read Roadcraft and other AD books but without any on road tuition, so I didn't truly understand the basic point.

[TheInsanity1234]

I arived at a pupils house yesterday evening to see a brand spanking new 1.2 Corsa on the drive. She'd saved her money and gone for new. The upside is that the car should be more trouble free and safer than one of six or seven years old. The downside is that it cost many more notes, and as Silk said, if you scrape it you'll feel worse about it than scraping an older car.

As Martin said, a Citroen C4 VTS is quite a powerfull car for a seventeen year old novice driver. The insurance quotes you are getting seem very low to me, and I would expect a Citroen C4 to be in excess of £2.5k per anum, and a VTS considerably more.

Not sure how, but it seems Privilege is happily quoting an average of £1.5k non-black-box for many cars I put in, but I do notice the cheaper, older cars are more expensive than the newer, more expensive cars. Obviously a case of "the newer and more expensive it is, the more careful the driver will be".

I really don't know how, but Privilege are doing rather cheap quotes, and even the next cheapest ones are usually black-box ones.

Is a C4 VTS really that powerful?

The quote for one of those was £2,123.95 per annum, with Drive Like A Girl, black box.

Compulsory excess at £300, voluntary at £250.

Put in less than a month, I've held the licence. No NCB. Full UK manual.

No additional drivers, no mother/father.

Full comprehensive, Social&Commuting, keep it on a drive overnight, 11k miles/year.

Those details are exactly the same as every other quote I've run through Confused.com, and the quotes always come up far, far cheaper than what some parents claim their children's cars are costing them in insurance.

I really don't know why my quotes are coming up so cheap when others claim £3k+ a year insurance.

[waremark]

Post code seems to make an enormous difference. You must have a fairly favourable one.

[TheInsanity1234]

Post code seems to make an enormous difference. You must have a fairly favourable one.

I live in an RG17 postcode.

Had a look at confused.com to see whether postcode makes a difference.

Everything is the same, just different postcode.

Here, a quote for a Renault Twingo Dynamic is £1,361.04/a

In Essex, at my old postcode, a quote for the same car is...

*drumroll*

£1,763.84.

Y'know what, I think I'm definitely happy about the move now

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

Now find a postcode in South London, say, or Walsall or Toxteth, and compare again...

[jont]

Now find a postcode in South London, say, or Walsall or Toxteth, and compare again...

Or Swindon

[fungus]

Is a C4 VTS really that powerful?

According to Parkers, the performance figures for the VTS are as follows,

The 2.0 HDI 138bhp 0 to 60 time is 9.4 seconds

1.6i 150bhp 8.1 seconds

2.0i 180bhp 8.0 seconds

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

Now find a postcode in South London, say, or Walsall or Toxteth, and compare again...

Or Swindon

I wouldn't know

[Grahar]

I would start with something modest and work on improving your driving first. If you go for something cheaper you can change more often for something more powerful as you build your no claim bonus. Buying a gradually more powerful and better car every few cars is really fun and gives you something to work for.

Having said this I went straight from a warmish hatch to a BMW 325ci Sport (coupe) in my mid twenties and wonderful though the BM was, I regret (a little) missing out on progressing through a few hot-hatches. To this day I've never driven a proper one...sob, sob...(and a hint to anyone generous who owns a Peugeot 306 Gti-6).

[TheInsanity1234]

Is a C4 VTS really that powerful?

According to Parkers, the performance figures for the VTS are as follows,

The 2.0 HDI 138bhp 0 to 60 time is 9.4 seconds

1.6i 150bhp 8.1 seconds

2.0i 180bhp 8.0 seconds

Wheep.

I'll give them a miss then

Didn't think the 1.6 would give out that much power too.

I would start with something modest and work on improving your driving first. If you go for something cheaper you can change more often for something more powerful as you build your no claim bonus. Buying a gradually more powerful and better car every few cars is really fun and gives you something to work for.

Having said this I went straight from a warmish hatch to a BMW 325ci Sport (coupe) in my mid twenties and wonderful though the BM was, I regret (a little) missing out on progressing through a few hot-hatches. To this day I've never driven a proper one...sob, sob...(and a hint to anyone generous who owns a Peugeot 306 Gti-6).

I'm okay with missing out the hot-hatch stage to be quite honest.
The only one I'd like is a Panda 100 HP, and keeping that for about 5 years, and when I've driven the floor off it, I'd consider getting into a nicer car. Avoid the hot hatch stage entirely. I just don't like them. Not sure why.

I mean, give me a nice Golf 2.0 TDI over a GTI any day.

[Grahar]

Diesels are very good these days (especially used as an every day car) but a decent petrol engined car provides a level of joy on a good road that a diesel can't hope to meet for these reasons:

1. They sound so much better.
2. They rev more freely.
3. They have a wider power band.

Because of how the performance is delivered and how they sound, diesels always feel like they're delivering their performance (stunning though it might be) in a slightly begrudging way.

I'm not saying you shouldn't buy a diesel, but at least take a decent petrol car for a spirited drive on a good road and compare with a diesel. I'm a true petrol head so for me a diesel car is always going to be a compromise to the joy of driving!

P.S A Panda 100 is borderline hot hatch so am not sure why you are conceptually against hot-hatches?!

[fungus]

Having said this I went straight from a warmish hatch to a BMW 325ci Sport (coupe) in my mid twenties and wonderful though the BM was, I regret (a little) missing out on progressing through a few hot-hatches. To this day I've never driven a proper one...sob, sob...(and a hint to anyone generous who owns a Peugeot 306 Gti-6).

My daughter went from a 1996 1.0L Nissan Micra to a 170bhp Mini Cooper S.

[Silk]

Diesels are very good these days (especially used as an every day car) but a decent petrol engined car provides a level of joy on a good road that a diesel can't hope to meet for these reasons:

1. They sound so much better.
2. They rev more freely.
3. They have a wider power band.

Because of how the performance is delivered and how they sound, diesels always feel like they're delivering their performance (stunning though it might be) in a slightly begrudging way.

You've obviously never been out in my A3. 170 metric horses of joy and still does over 50mpg. It even sounds nice. Plus, it's not French.

Petrols tend to feel a bit weedy to me in comparison. Although a lot of that may be down to needing a slightly different driving style.