HPC or IAM Masters?

[Horse]

http://rapidtraining.co.uk/trainers.html

Scroll down

[TripleS]

I suspect that Steve's experiences with AM will be somewhat similar to my own....

By the way, what is Andy Morrison's background? Ex Hendon etc.?

I think it does Andy a disservice to stereotype him as just another PC1.

No disservice intended, nor indeed stereotyping of any kind. I was merely asking about his background, assuming it possibly to be as an ex. Hendon advanced driving trainer.

[TripleS]

By the way, what is Andy Morrison's background? Ex Hendon etc.?

By the same token what background do Mark Kendrick and Andy Walsh have. Limit handling, or high performance road driving, etc.?

For Andy's background see http://www.high-performance-course.com/course-managers

Thank you, John.

[TripleS]

The great thing about Andy morrison seems to be that a) he has the credibility and experience from his police background, but b) he has an ability to open your eyes to driving options / tools / skills and see how you can use them to further your aims...

when I spent several days with him recently we had a detailed discussion about my previous experience of cars / what I enjoyed & disliked / what I wanted from driving / my pattern of driving / my experiences / etc. - he then very much took me on my personal journey and really made me aware of a number of things I could improve (and how to), and showed me some of the possibilities ahead in learning. He is not dogmatic about there only being one way of doing things, he looks at understanding why steering (for example) can be done in several ways and the strengths and weaknesses - and then takes you through them step by step with practical demonstrations - a great mix of coaching and teaching

it is his attitude as much as anything that is so good - I will return!

Alasdair

Now that sounds like the sort of training I would go for if I didn't feel it to be too late for me. Unfortunately my concern now is to minimise the rate of (age related) deterioration in my driving.

Even so, I'm still looking to make minor improvements in various ways, so the suggestion, which some have periodically made, that I'm not interested in improving is, and always was, completely unfounded.

I also don't buy the idea that the self-taught route is valueless, though I do accept it isn't the best way of proceeding, but that relates to another thread. I just make the points here while we're about it.

Anyhow, many thanks for your post, Alasdair.

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

the suggestion, which some have periodically made, that I'm not interested in improving is, and always was, completely unfounded.

Very glad to hear it. If only you didn't keep saying you were happy with your current position, and don't believe in the standard AD methods of teaching, it'd be easier to believe. I hope you find a way in which you can accept input from others eventually though, because despite your next point, it can expedite progress way beyond what you can achieve on your own.

I also don't buy the idea that the self-taught route is valueless

Not valueless, but of finite usefulness. If you never get feedback from anyone else, how do you know if you're improving, or cementing bad habits?

Good luck, anyway.

I enjoyed the books from your reading list, by the way. Lots of good sense in them.

[akirk]

Now that sounds like the sort of training I would go for if I didn't feel it to be too late for me. Unfortunately my concern now is to minimise the rate of (age related) deterioration in my driving.

Even so, I'm still looking to make minor improvements in various ways, so the suggestion, which some have periodically made, that I'm not interested in improving is, and always was, completely unfounded.

I also don't buy the idea that the self-taught route is valueless, though I do accept it isn't the best way of proceeding, but that relates to another thread. I just make the points here while we're about it.

Anyhow, many thanks for your post, Alasdair.

I would encourage a day with him, not because of what anyone on here thinks / or with any specific goal or need - simply that he is an interesting and capable chap, and I feel that using someone with experience as a coach helps us firm up / ditch our beliefs and habits...

Alasdair

[jcochrane]

Andy is a coach that I have learnt to trust completely in the advice and guidance he gives and I think that is very important in deciding which coach to go to.

I've watched him coach others and he has a knack of knowing how to get the best out of a driver. His coaching technique is tailored to suit a person.

I am very much a self taught driver and so when driving with him we talk on many things but driving and it is at the tea break that he suggest "development points" I may want to try out. Of course the points always add something to my driving. He just drops a seed of thought and lets me play with the idea, That's the way he coaches me because he understands that is how I have always taught myself, through self experimentation and development of an idea.

He has way of understanding you and what you may be thinking. On one exception to his usual approach with me he did something different. I'd travelled through a section of road with bends that could be taken happily in either 4th or 3rd. For some I chose 4th and for some 3rd. but wondering to myself whether I needed to change down and what would be the result if I took all the bends in 4th. To my astonishment he asked me to pull over said he had timed me over the section and suggested I might like to drive the section again but without the use of 3rd gear. It was as if he had read my mind. Anyway I followed his suggestion and he pulled me over at the same point as before to tell me that I completed the section 10% quicker! In my view he is one hell of a coach and it is no wonder that he is in such demand.

TripleS.
I believe we may not be very far apart in age but I find coaching from Andy always helps me improve. Don't let age be a barrier.

[Silk]

Ah, I see, he was being sarcastic. He should have said.

Leg pull rather than sarcastic hence the

That's ok then. From one Pug driver to another.

So where do we take the HPC test, and how much does it cost?

[jcochrane]

Ah, I see, he was being sarcastic. He should have said.

Leg pull rather than sarcastic hence the

That's ok then. From one Pug driver to another.

So where do we take the HPC test, and how much does it cost?

Now you know you've opened the door for the Pug, sorry I mean plug.

So here it is.....

Follow the link http://www.high-performance-course.com to the new web site about the course.

[zadocbrown]

Spare us....

There is no HPC 'test'. It's a course of driver development. As an aside, people who come to IAM wanting to just pass a test rarely get much out of it.....

[TripleS]

the suggestion, which some have periodically made, that I'm not interested in improving is, and always was, completely unfounded.

Very glad to hear it. If only you didn't keep saying you were happy with your current position, and don't believe in the standard AD methods of teaching, it'd be easier to believe. I hope you find a way in which you can accept input from others eventually though, because despite your next point, it can expedite progress way beyond what you can achieve on your own.

I also don't buy the idea that the self-taught route is valueless

Not valueless, but of finite usefulness. If you never get feedback from anyone else, how do you know if you're improving, or cementing bad habits?

Good luck, anyway.

I enjoyed the books from your reading list, by the way. Lots of good sense in them.

I'm generally happy with my current position in the sense that it works OK; i.e. I don't find myself getting into difficulties, either with other road users or the road itself; but at the same time I am aware of shortcomings, things i would like to improve, and I try to make improvements in those areas.

[Silk]

Spare us....

There is no HPC 'test'. It's a course of driver development. As an aside, people who come to IAM wanting to just pass a test rarely get much out of it.....

So we're not really comparing like with like, are we? All you're doing with HPC is signing up for a bit of coaching from an ex-Police driver. HPC don't even offer a test, so that people who may be interested can't see how they measure up. I'd want to at least know what stage I'm at now before parting with over 1000 quid.

[akirk]

Spare us....

There is no HPC 'test'. It's a course of driver development. As an aside, people who come to IAM wanting to just pass a test rarely get much out of it.....

So we're not really comparing like with like, are we? All you're doing with HPC is signing up for a bit of coaching from an ex-Police driver. HPC don't even offer a test, so that people who may be interested can't see how they measure up. I'd want to at least know what stage I'm at now before parting with over 1000 quid.

I am not sure quite what you mean...
but that isn't how the high performance course works...
I had two half days with Andy Morrison looking at where I was at that point and some learning points between... I then did the two day course - again full of learning...

Andy debriefed me during and after each session (half or full day) and then emailed me a written report after each. The end of the course had a 9 page written report including a 49 point assessment each scored individually. Very detailed feedback.

you don't have to sign up for everything at once - however the two day course is taken as a full sequential two days - but you can buy into just an initial assessment day and know what stage you are at by the end of it - I suspect that he would know by the end of the first few roads - he is very discerning

and the course doesn't have to be over £1,000 - the half day assessment and 2 day course was less than that

I suspect that the reason you feel there is no test is because the course is continually assessed rather than the IAM model of observing and then putting in for a 'test' with the examiner - however HPC isn't a series of observed drives carried out by amateurs, but a training course run by a professional - the 'test' occurs throughout the course and you are assessed against the course syllabus: http://www.high-performance-course.com/syllabus

but ultimately Andy Morrison is a professional coach - you could choose to drop him a line and ask for training / testing / etc. to fit your needs - it wouldn't be the high performanc course, but if you want something different just ask him...

So I knew very clearly in debrief and written report exactly where I was before the committment to the actual course / and had an even more detailed analysis by the end... worked for me

Alasdair

NB - this is not to disagree with zadocbrown - there is no formal 'test' - however that doesn't mean you are not being tested / assessed - know where you stand...

[jcochrane]

Forum members can decide for themselves what to think of the views expressed but if unsure can try out a half day with Andy or Clive as there is no commitment to go back to them if not happy with the training given. Andy and Clive will discuss your goals with you and adapt the training accordingly.

[Horse]

With a bit of imagination, a test doesn't have to be a test. I had one guy who I knew suffered from'test nerves', so I lied to him: "Let's just go for a ride" . . . Which happened to take in a test route. Then I told him the result.