ADUK Archive

Hence don't carry too much speed into a hazard. If I saw it coming in the clip I definately saw it on the road. He could have braked in my opinion... and if not that, he should have foreseen it and been ready to brake within the distance e.t.c.

why was the truck moving illegally into lane three on a completely clear road ?
I don't think it was explained on the clip (other than just it was a lorry and therefore driven badly).

He was turning right at the roundabout ahead, and positioning for the right turn. In fact lane 3 ends before the roundabout, but I did not notice a sign indicating the end of the lane. I am not clear how far before the roundabout the heavy moved into lane 3.

Supposing that lane 3 had continued to the roundabout, how far before the roundabout would a heavy be allowed to move into lane 3?

Anyway, it was a bad driving error by Langley, aggravated by a wholly inappropriate manner afterwards to the HGV driver. My main concern was that this was apparently presented on TV with no indication that Langley could have been in the wrong.

hpcdriver wrote:

Supposing that lane 3 had continued to the roundabout, how far before the roundabout would a heavy be allowed to move into lane 3?

I assume that it would be at the point that the junction signs start saying which lane to be in for different exits, around the 1/2 mile mark.

I don't know of any junctions like that though, roundabouts on motorways are very rare if indeed there are any.

All the junctions I can think of come from two lanes out into the junction of upto 5 lanes (I think 5 is the most i've seen).

Roadcraft wrote:

TripleS wrote:Hmm, that's not quite what I said, but I don't suppose you liked my version.
Best wishes all,
Dave.

No it wasn't...but one gets tired of the bollox about 'real' crimes etc...

Like the law is something you can pick and choose your preferences....

There are those people who think litter laws aren't real laws...and therefore drop litter.....

Speeding is a crime. We all do it. Fact. If we're caught, we're caught. You could always have the other 900,000 previous crimes taken into consideration....

Like I always say...if you do it and get away with it - Great. If you do it and get caught - Hard Cheese...

I'm in the same boat as you...

Well, 'bollox' you say, but it's not always that easy though, is it?

You, as a Police Officer, will know a great deal more about the law than do most of us, but it is increasingly the case that ordinary members of the public must be finding it ever more difficult to know how to stay legal 100%, even if they really wanted to do so. There are simply too many laws being introdced for us to be aware of all of them.

In any event, I suspect most of us pick and choose which ones to comply with, to some degree, and in the vast majority of cases no harm is done, so i don't think it's necessarily something to be overly concerned about.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

hpcdriver wrote:He was turning right at the roundabout ahead, and positioning for the right turn. In fact lane 3 ends before the roundabout, but I did not notice a sign indicating the end of the lane. I am not clear how far before the roundabout the heavy moved into lane 3.

Supposing that lane 3 had continued to the roundabout, how far before the roundabout would a heavy be allowed to move into lane 3?

Anyway, it was a bad driving error by Langley, aggravated by a wholly inappropriate manner afterwards to the HGV driver. My main concern was that this was apparently presented on TV with no indication that Langley could have been in the wrong.

Maybe the HGV driver would not have needed to be given access to lane 3. Perhaps lane 2 could have been marked (by a sign and/or arrows on the road) to permit right turns.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

Standard Dave wrote:

hpcdriver wrote:

Supposing that lane 3 had continued to the roundabout, how far before the roundabout would a heavy be allowed to move into lane 3?

I assume that it would be at the point that the junction signs start saying which lane to be in for different exits, around the 1/2 mile mark.

I don't know of any junctions like that though, roundabouts on motorways are very rare if indeed there are any.

All the junctions I can think of come from two lanes out into the junction of upto 5 lanes (I think 5 is the most i've seen).

This appears to be at the west end of the M180 where it meets the M18, and the roundabout is because the M180 finishes at this point. It is indeed a roundabout, but it has a big hole in the middle.

Google Maps provide good views of the area. HTH.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

Standard Dave wrote:...roundabouts on motorways are very rare if indeed there are any.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=52.047793,-2.135414&spn=0.002903,0.007231&t=k&z=17&om=1
(M50/M5 junction)

I believe this RAB is under motorway rules.

When I saw this clip I did wonder if it was a case of 'red mist' especially from the fact that he was talking about what the other driver was 'thinking'.

To my understanding 'Red mist behavior' could be as simple as someone concentrating (reasonably calmly) on getting home after work & not individual situations, but could at an extreme be a policeman shouting and swearing & taking rediculous risks because he personally won't be 'beaten'.

Still do wonder if this was partially the case.

ASW.

waremark wrote:Supposing that lane 3 had continued to the roundabout, how far before the roundabout would a heavy be allowed to move into lane 3?

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but the answer is never in England, but they can in Scotland.

A little late to the party

This video has only just come to my attention.

He also approached the lorry with just wig-wags going

Not so. The PO never said they were on, he said headlights, & no reflections are seen on signs or the back of the lorry. These can clearly be seen when he switches them on after impact.

The film also stated that he was only using flashing headlights

Indeed the presenter did say that.

If you go to Google earth & search for M180, then look at the approach to the M18 junction, this must be where he was traveling down the hatched area in the 2nd clip.
Interestingly, if you pan back to the last junction on the M180 you can clearly see 2 trucks both encroaching lane 3 ! Use the tilt function so you're looking down on them with the road from bottom to top of your screen. (untick "show roads" so you get a clearer view of the road markings).

try 53°35'32.41"N 0°58'14.63"W (have now place marked it, apologies i don't know how to give a link to it).

I think there is a 3rd factor here besides the 2 drivers: the road design.

The major route direction sign for the junction ahead is just before the over bridge. It is relatively rare to have a roundabout at the end of a m/way (they usually continue onto an A road).I think that having seen the route layout sign, if wanting to turn right onto the M18 they will initially think they need to be getting over to the right (yes i know no HGV lane 3, but they could well be expecting the right lane to be marked up for right turn on approach to the rab, those markings would then over ride the HGV ban), then sometime after you go under the bridge, the white arrows come up in lane 3. I can't see on On G earth the signs advising lane 3 ending, there will surely be some. Further on it becomes clear as there is another sign showing only the 2 lanes. The whole set up is potentially dangerous even just for cars because you have the right lane closing immediately after the on slip. (traffic tends to move a lane to the right to let people on).
The m/way has clearly been designed with the 3rd lane continuing to the rab, but has subsequently been hatched off.

"I'm gonna catch that BM driver no matter what & nobody is going to get in my way"!