Over-taking a block of cars

[drivingschoolnewbury]

A friend of mine who is a police officer told me about a guy who works in the office as a civilian who used to be a police motorbike rider. This guy was riding home on his bike after work one day and decided to overtake a car in front. Unknown to him there was a concealed entrance on the right. A car pulled out of the entrance straight towards the police officer on his motorbike. The officer had one of his legs sliced off in the accident! I know the car emerging should have been more aware, however if a trained police motorbike rider can get it wrong what chance do us lesser mortals have? By it's very name "concealed" entrance means it couldn't be seen or easily seen. How do any of us know if there is a concealed entrance ahead on the right that could have a vehicle emerging from it. Since I heard this story I haven't overtaken a single thing.

[jcochrane]

A friend of mine who is a police officer told me about a guy who works in the office as a civilian who used to be a police motorbike rider. This guy was riding home on his bike after work one day and decided to overtake a car in front. Unknown to him there was a concealed entrance on the right. A car pulled out of the entrance straight towards the police officer on his motorbike. The officer had one of his legs sliced off in the accident! I know the car emerging should have been more aware, however if a trained police motorbike rider can get it wrong what chance do us lesser mortals have? By it's very name "concealed" entrance means it couldn't be seen or easily seen. How do any of us know if there is a concealed entrance ahead on the right that could have a vehicle emerging from it. Since I heard this story I haven't overtaken a single thing.

Sometimes other clues can help to anticipate the likelihood of a concealed entrance/building. The appearance of a wall or hedge, the brief glimpse of a chimney, a reduction in the speed limit, overhead telephone wires going off to the side of the road, a lighter patch of road (ie. no shadow cast suggesting a break in the hedge or wall), skid marks, finger post, signs of road wear from turning traffic etc. etc.

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

When you pull out of a junction or entrance turning left, in which direction are you looking as you start to move out? Yup, back along the nearside in case of any traffic coming from your right, on your side of the carriageway. Most people only transfer their vision forward once their car is well out onto the carriageway. This was reinforced in the 80s and 90s with the "Think bike" campaign, which always had the bike approaching from the right of the vehicle pulling out. It may also be reinforced by the Green Cross Code which was drummed into many adults of today as children:

"Look right, then left, then right again"

All this makes junctions on the right very dangerous places when overtaking. Maybe the emerging vehicle could have done something about it, but the onus was on the bike rider to look for hazards before committing to the overtake. Most bike overtakes are over in a very short time, too - say 3 or 4 seconds, so he was pretty unlucky to time it just as the car emerged.

[Big Err]

would that be on the 'airport road' by perchance?

That's the fella - the hatchings are really quite emphatic, and I don't think I've ever seen anyone else go for an overtake there. The downside of that it doesn't get 'swept' very often so you have to watch out for stuff in the road.

The two trucks were doing about 35-ish, so it actually quite a relaxed move - plenty of time to confirm the target vehicles' lack of ambition before committing.

Should've gotten the details to me for Tuesday past for a quick look at whilst down there. It's good fun trying to interpret why things have been done - right or wrong

[Octy_Ross]

A friend of mine who is a police officer told me about a guy who works in the office as a civilian who used to be a police motorbike rider. This guy was riding home on his bike after work one day and decided to overtake a car in front. Unknown to him there was a concealed entrance on the right. A car pulled out of the entrance straight towards the police officer on his motorbike. The officer had one of his legs sliced off in the accident! I know the car emerging should have been more aware, however if a trained police motorbike rider can get it wrong what chance do us lesser mortals have? By it's very name "concealed" entrance means it couldn't be seen or easily seen. How do any of us know if there is a concealed entrance ahead on the right that could have a vehicle emerging from it. Since I heard this story I haven't overtaken a single thing.

I heard about someone choking on a nut once - never eaten one since....

How do you teach your students to overtake?

do you extend your waiting behind things to tractors?

[ExadiNigel]

There's a similar stretch of road between Marlborough & Hungerfordhttp://maps.google.co.uk/maps?oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&ie=UTF8&q=cobbs+farm+shop&fb=1&gl=uk&hq=cobbs+farm+shop&cid=0,0,16063070556974362898&ei=fMPJTL2FNo_QjAe2rsjzDw&ved=0CBsQnwIwAQ&hnear=&ll=51.415361,-1.539373&spn=0.005473,0.020792&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.415412,-1.539238&panoid=BYS-bzhL2j1g-T_ZcvUN9Q&cbp=12,89.98,,0,2.03, good wide lane in the middle of the road hatched out. Often took pupils along there to highlight that the hatched lane can be used for overtaking.

I think some of these are overhangs from when we used to have a lot of roads with the old suicide lane down the middle so the middle lane was hatched in to discourage drivers from using them.

[PeterE]

How do any of us know if there is a concealed entrance ahead on the right that could have a vehicle emerging from it.

There are plenty of roads, especially unfenced ones, but also many modern single carriageways, where visibility is such that you can clearly see there is no concealed entrance. Also, in many cases, you will be driving along familiar roads where you already know there are no concealed entrances.

[ExadiNigel]

Since I heard this story I haven't overtaken a single thing.

Sounds a very odd statement to come from a professional trainer

[Octy_Ross]

Sounds a very odd statement to come from a professional trainer

What I said, less facetiously

[ExadiNigel]

Sounds a very odd statement to come from a professional trainer

What I said, less facetiously

I know. Unusual for me really.

Nigel

[waremark]

You don't assume there is no entrance just because you cannot see an entrance; but if you can see that there is no entrance you may be able to overtake safely.

[Octy_Ross]

Now I have both hands for typing; yesterday I had biscuits.

This has nearly happened to me; overtaking someone whilst a vehicle from a private drive pulled out. Luckily she pulled out *just* behind me...

I missed the entrance (so did my passenger who commented "where'd she come from") There was no sign for the entrance etc. etc.

One thing that does plague me from this experience though is, if I hadn't been looking to overtake perhaps I'd have seen the entrance....

[Gareth]

Some look for reasons to overtake, others for reasons not to overtake. Understanding this difference can result in increased awareness in those who fall into the former category.

I'm not sure whether, if one is inclined one way, the other can be learned.

[TripleS]

How do any of us know if there is a concealed entrance ahead on the right that could have a vehicle emerging from it.

There are plenty of roads, especially unfenced ones, but also many modern single carriageways, where visibility is such that you can clearly see there is no concealed entrance. Also, in many cases, you will be driving along familiar roads where you already know there are no concealed entrances.

Yes, but what if a farmer has opened up a new entrance to his field since you last travelled that road a few days earlier? That was a point mentioned by Von some time back. Question is: how far do we go in attempting to cater for all eventualities? Your guess is as good as mine.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[TripleS]

Now I have both hands for typing; yesterday I had biscuits.

This has nearly happened to me; overtaking someone whilst a vehicle from a private drive pulled out. Luckily she pulled out *just* behind me...

I missed the entrance (so did my passenger who commented "where'd she come from") There was no sign for the entrance etc. etc.

One thing that does plague me from this experience though is, if I hadn't been looking to overtake perhaps I'd have seen the entrance....

Maybe this is where Chris Gilbert's main beam / dipped beam use of the eyes comes in. I've found this can be a problem; looking long range, and then falling over something in the foreground.

This AD lark is funny: maybe we sometimes spend too much time analysing things, and those who just get on with it - without too much conscious thinking - fare better in many situations.

Best wishes all,
Dave.