michael769 wrote:trashbat wrote:I bet others on here are better informed, but I think the roads folk do have 3D scene image capture, and parties such as vehicle manufacturers (at least in some countries) do show an active investigative interest in fatal accidents involving their vehicles.
I believe Volvo has a team in Sweden that goes out to accidents.
trashbat wrote:A fatal plane crash is hundreds of lives in one moment, mostly people who were owed (and paid for) a duty of care, often avoidable with just one correction. There's also a lot of money in it - cost and liability. On the roads, although they quickly add up to many more, each car crash is just a few people in isolation, in varied and complex circumstances, and the apparent cash at stake is low.
Big Err wrote:The other large diffeence between the two forms of investigations is that most(?) Air Accidents involve Professionals through out - Pilots, Air Traffic Control, Maintenance Teams etc. Each one has clearly defined roles, rules to adhere to and responsibilities. Meanwhile the roads are full of Amateurs (many of us included).
martine wrote:No most air accidents involve no loss of life at all - they are still investigated and recommendations made. A further chunk involve crashes where most people survive - it's a common misconception that once something goes wrong in an aircraft (or piloting) then all the occupants are doomed. The majority of air crashes are primarily due to pilot error - much like RTCs.
There are differences of course between air and road 'incidents' and the way the attitude and system works...I am suggesting we should make RTC investigation more like air - why not?
martine wrote:Big Err wrote:The other large diffeence between the two forms of investigations is that most(?) Air Accidents involve Professionals through out - Pilots, Air Traffic Control, Maintenance Teams etc. Each one has clearly defined roles, rules to adhere to and responsibilities. Meanwhile the roads are full of Amateurs (many of us included).
I'm not sure that's true actually...I wouldn't be surprised if most were with non-professional pilots at the controls but I don't have the figures to hand. Anyone?
sussex2 wrote:Interesting.
My father was one of the founders of CHIRP (Confidential human factors incident reporting) a system whereby pilots could report incidents anonymously).
Over years access to the reports would have helped a lot of people in the aviation business.
martine wrote:sussex2 wrote:Interesting.
My father was one of the founders of CHIRP (Confidential human factors incident reporting) a system whereby pilots could report incidents anonymously).
Over years access to the reports would have helped a lot of people in the aviation business.
Yes and a fine system that is too. It probably only really comes into play when a professional pilot is under pressure by their employer to do something illegal or bad practice. I'm not sure that applies to most RTCs - lorries/buses excepted.
Ancient wrote:What are the rules on combined office work and driving? How many keep to them (or even know them)?
Ancient wrote:What are the rules on combined office work and driving? How many keep to them (or even know them)?
martine wrote:Ancient wrote:What are the rules on combined office work and driving? How many keep to them (or even know them)?
There are no official rules for car drivers...but you could well be right...about 400 fatalaties per year are people driving for work yet the HSE seem to make more noise about building site risks.
triquet wrote:
Mmm. One might conjecture that driver fatigue might figure rather high in this ...
michael769 wrote:triquet wrote:
Mmm. One might conjecture that driver fatigue might figure rather high in this ...
Probably also a degree of time pressure....
martine wrote: No most air accidents involve no loss of life at all
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