Managed Motorways - safety

[Horse]

The If you can't do any of those, Darwin gets another brownie point. It isn't fun or pretty, but eventually it works. Monkeys occasionally fall out of trees, but they still swing about up there.

The level of the lowest common denominator needs raising.

Really? How do you suggest that is achieved?

Do expert drivers have a reduced illusion of superiority?
Andrea E. Waylena,
Mark S. Horswillb, , ,
Jane L. Alexanderc,
Frank P. McKennac

Abstract

It is well established that people tend to rate themselves as better than average across many domains. To maintain these illusions, it is suggested that people distort feedback about their own and others’ performance. This study examined expert/novice differences in self-ratings when people compared themselves with others of the same level of expertise and background as themselves. Given that a key expert characteristic is increased self-monitoring, we predicted that experts in a domain may have a reduced illusion of superiority because they are more aware of their actual ability. We compared expert police drivers with novice police drivers and found that this prediction was not supported. Expert police drivers rated themselves as superior to equally qualified drivers, to the same degree as novices, Cohen’s d = .03 ns. Despite their extensive additional training and experience, experts still appear to be as susceptible to illusions of superiority as everyone else.

http://centaur.reading.ac.uk/13822/
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 7804000440 < may work for you

[Gromit37]

Here is the simple truth of the matter. Every day across the planet, people die. Some through illness, some through deliberate acts, some in accidents. That is how it is. You cannot dial death out of the equation. You can move the responsibility around all you like, but one day, we are all going to die. I have lost people close to me, and whether it be through accident, illness or any other means, it still hurts.

Accidents will always happen. Full stop. The question then becomes one of "who is responsible?". The driver of a car that ploughs into a broken down vehicle? The camera operator who didn't see the breakdown? The manufacturer of the cameras? The engineers who positioned the cameras? The company that produces the software? The programmer himself? Where does the 'blame' go? Whichever it is, somewhere there is always a weak link that can never be forseen or just isn't worth the time and cost to rectify because the risks are too small. Accidents will happen, people will die. Risk is part of life. So is responsibility for one's own actions.

So emotive arguments about informing families, whilst sad, is one that doesn't actually prove anything. People are largely responsible for themselves in their everyday lives.

As for arguments about 'experts', see the above. Nobody is immune from accidents. Everybody makes mistakes. So give people a framework to work in and leave the rest to the individual, hoping that they don't cock it up too much or too often.

Of course, when the national speed limit becomes 20mph, and control is taken away from the driver, people across the country will be up in arms. But guess what? Somebody will still die in an accident.

[Horse]

Here is the simple truth of the matter. Every day across the planet, people die. Some through illness, some through deliberate acts, some in accidents. That is how it is. You cannot dial death out of the equation. You can move the responsibility around all you like, but one day, we are all going to die. I have lost people close to me, and whether it be through accident, illness or any other means

Now here's a thing: I was asked in another thread about my pet hates, and you've nudged into one of them.

No-one's allowed to die.

Improvements in . . . well, everything (healthcare, road safety, yada yada) mean that no-one is allowed to die.

And it really gets worse when the claim is made about 'lives saved'. Err no. Not saved, just delayed, or - being positive - given the opportunity to get terminally ill with something else.

Rant over. Normal service will be resumed shortly.

[Gromit37]

I agree with you on this Horse. Hah... me agreeing with somebody. I must be getting soft in my old age,

[MGF]

No hospital treatment for life threatening conditions then. Just let nature take its course?

[Horse]

No hospital treatment for life threatening conditions then. Just let nature take its course?

With increasing antibiotic-resistant bugs, treatment options in the future may be limited anyway.

[triquet]

Antibiotics never worked for hard shoulders anyway ....

[Horse]

Antibiotics never worked for hard shoulders anyway ....

Errr. So that white paint the council put around potholes *isn't* Savlon so they heal up?

[Gromit37]

No hospital treatment for life threatening conditions then. Just let nature take its course?

Unfortunately your analogy is flawed. Hopefully you can see the differences between wrapping people in cotton wool to protect them from everything the big bad world has to offer and treating them once something bad has happened. But one thing I can absolutely guarantee... no matter how good medicine becomes, however knowledgeable doctors are and despite any measures taken to control danger, accidents will happen, people will get sick and people will still die.

The point being, that trying to absolve people by removing all of their individual responsibilities is not a good survival strategy. It never has and never will work the way people want it to.

[zadocbrown]

I use the M62 regularly, part of which has recently become a managed motorway. In my experience it works pretty well. The hard shoulder running is only one aspect of the scheme and overall the road feels noticeably safer to me. Now that most people have worked out how to use it.......

[jont]

Travelling home last night along the M42 (in the "managed" section) I came across a number of people treating the hard shoulder as a running lane, even though there was no signage or reduced limit in place (and traffic was flowing reasonably freely)

[zadocbrown]

I seem to think up here there is normally a red cross over the hard shoulder at all times it is not in use. A wise precaution.

[jont]

I seem to think up here there is normally a red cross over the hard shoulder at all times it is not in use. A wise precaution.

Hmmm.
Hard shoul­der run­ning — "The hard shoul­der will be opened at busy times and the speed limit will be reduced. Do NOT use the hard shoul­der unless over­head signs show that you can do so"

This was with a solid line (normal hard shoulder style), rather than "all-lane running"

[Horse]

I seem to think up here there is normally a red cross over the hard shoulder at all times it is not in use. A wise precaution.

Ubtil recently I didn't know that there's two types of red 'X', one of which is 'broken' [intentionally]. IIRC not legally enforceable as the full version.

[zadocbrown]

I seem to think up here there is normally a red cross over the hard shoulder at all times it is not in use. A wise precaution.

Hmmm.
Hard shoul­der run­ning — "The hard shoul­der will be opened at busy times and the speed limit will be reduced. Do NOT use the hard shoul­der unless over­head signs show that you can do so"

This was with a solid line (normal hard shoulder style), rather than "all-lane running"

Yes, no red cross is strictly necessary. But it makes sense to use one over the hard shoulder if it is used as a running lane at other times. The clarity costs nothing (well virtually nothing) and may help the cerebrally challenged to work out where they should be....