Risky topic!

[TheInsanity1234]

Now I'm approaching the date of my driving test, I've started to ponder what my driving plan should be after passing. I'm going to do Pass Plus, that's certain.

But I'm wondering what I should do regarding advanced driving (is it just me that despises calling it "advanced"? Makes us sound like a bunch of old farts with nothing better to do in our lives ).

What are the pros and cons of RoADAR vs IAM?

RoADAR seems to be more of a professional body that focuses more on reducing accidents, whereas IAM seems to be more voluntary run and focuses more on the 'fun' part of driving (not that the big cheese seems to be of that frame of mind).

Which do you guys think is better?

Why?

I hope I can glean some useful information from this thread! Thanks

[akirk]

I am sure you will pass your test, so good to plan...

whatever you do - the key is the attitude of wanting to always improve.

I would argue that it doesn't matter which you do - RoADAR / IAM - either way, don't see it as a destination, but rather a doorway - onto a journey. The big difference between the standard car test for your driving licence and then AD is that the first teaches you basic car control - the second teaches you how to actually drive

you also need to factor in that a part of AD is experience and miles under your belt - so don't see it as a series of trophies for immediate conquering - if you see it as life long learning that is more accurate - and then the IAM / RoADAR courses are tools to help you develop / and to tick off progress on that journey...

until you are teaching the courses you haven't really arrived - and even then there is always more to learn!

Alasdair

[TheInsanity1234]

Why would I need to improve?

I'm perfect, the test is just a mere formality!



joking aside, that's my exact attitude! I don't want to do the AD stuff just so I can brag about my better driving, I want to do AD stuff because I genuinely want to make sure I can drive as well and safely as I can.
(Also, the lure of slightly lower insurance premiums is quite irresistible indeed)

But I also meant to ask, what is the process?
are there official paid people or are they just very dedicated members who get paid a pittance to cover small expenses?
what are observed runs?
What's the general process?

[Ralge]

I don't have any first-hand experience of IAM so I can't offer a direct comparison.
Rospa's qualification is seen within the driver training business as the higher qualification (none of my paymasters stipulated IAM's AD qualification but they do value RoSPA's.) RoSPA is re-tested every three years and has three pass grades, quite distinct from IAM's pass/fail approach.
Whether IAM's "First" (or any other badge) has changed or will change the status quo remains to be seen, I reckon.
Both should really be the same. Both organisations use volunteers at base AD qualification so the quality of observers/trainers in both is, well, variable. Examiners for both organisations can actually be the same body - my Rospa examiner, a serving traffic bobbie, is also the local IAM examiner.
IAM are more active and are better known by Jo Public but that's because they have a much sharper marketing focus on AD. That's all they do, after all.
RoSPA, by contrast, have a longstanding and much broader Health & Safety remit and driver assessments and training is but a small part of the whole.

[Ralge]

Why would I need to improve?

I'm perfect, the test is just a mere formality!



joking aside, that's my exact attitude! I don't want to do the AD stuff just so I can brag about my better driving, I want to do AD stuff because I genuinely want to make sure I can drive as well and safely as I can.
(Also, the lure of slightly lower insurance premiums is quite irresistible indeed)

But I also meant to ask, what is the process?
are there official paid people or are they just very dedicated members who get paid a pittance to cover small expenses?
what are observed runs?
What's the general process?

From memory, so will most likely be out-of-date:
For ROSPA, join the local group, not very expensive.
Read, digest HC, Roadcraft.
Organise an observed run, in your vehicle, your fuel.
Agree a "training" plan and objectives. Arrange to meet up again and again for however long it takes to get to the "standard".
Once there, be observed by the group'so senior observer to validate the first observer's assessment.
Pay some more (£40-50) for the test and national RoSPA membership.
Arrange to meet up with examiner. Take test.
Pay yearly membership to RoSPA thereafter with re-tests thrown in (http://www.roadar.org/drivers/info/memb ... n-form.doc)

Significantly cheaper than IAM, I believe.

Ps. Observers are volunteers.

[skodatezzer]

Makes us sound like a bunch of old farts with nothing better to do in our lives ).)

Right, that's enough anti-old-fartist rhetoric from you, young shaver!!
Now to the serious bit. Pass-plus good. After that either IAM or Roadar - suspect there's little difference as in both cases the training will be delivered by volunteers and, as mentioned above, the examiners for both organisations (who will be serving or retired Police advanced drivers) may well be one and the same. Given that the trainers are volunteers, I'd have to say that your experience would be very much determined by the people within the group. My lot in East Surrey are a fun loving bunch with a number of very fine drivers who display an infectious enthusiasm for AD, a healthy cynicism about "head office", and a flexible approach to training which tries to adapt to the needs of the individual trainee, but I hear of others with a dour, rigid approach, who want only to get your test pass as another number to their credit, and who offer nothing "post-test". Argument about which test is more stringent, or which bit of paper is more impressive, is redundant, in my opinion. Both are only stepping stones to start you on a continuing process of improvement. You make it quite clear from all your posts that it is a continuing process that you seek - I can tell you, as a proud old fart, that it's actually a life-long journey, and damn good fun.

So - pass your test, pass-plus then investigate both Roadar and IAM locally to you, and go with whoever gives you better vibes. Roadar is cheaper - IAM Skill for Life package is £149 at present. That's probably enough forward planning at this stage - once you've achieved IAM / Roadar there'll be people on here who can point you towards the next steps. One last thought - ADUK driving days. Keep an eye on the Driver Network, and if anything gets organised which is within striking distance of you, speak up. I'm sure I'm not the only one on this forum who'd be happy to invite you along, even as a non driving guest, and you'd have the opportunity to see some very good drivers in action. Good luck with the test - I'm sure vyou'll be keeping us up to date with developments!

Oh yeah, an observed drive is just what it says - you driving your car with an observer / coach beside you passing on pearls of wisdom (you hope). Difference between that and a session with a driving instructor is that you're in charge of the vehicle and are responsible for your safety, and that of your passenger. Your observer may decide to give you a demonstration drive which would be in his/her own vehicle.

[Gareth]

What are the pros and cons of RoADAR vs IAM?

In your area, and from direct knowledge, I can highly recommend a few members of the local IAM group possibly based to your east, and at least one member of the local RoADAR group possibly based to your west. All the people I have in mind post here with varying frequency.

[Kimosabe]

My opinion on asking the IAM or RoADAR/RoSPA to improve my driving abilities is, if I knew then what I now know, I would have found myself a really good driving coach who would have personalised my sessions to my needs.

The question pivots around whether or not you need to pass a test or whether you would be better served by improving your driving standards in another way. It's going to be much more expensive to pay a driving coach than it is to join either organisation, have one of their friendly, well meaning and as in my experience, irritatingly dogmatic volunteers tell you what they need you to know in a way which implies that you cannot be a better driver unless you pass their tests. If you do choose to take this route, I'd advise finding a group in which one of our seriously good and generous forum members is an observer and see if there's a way by which you could arrange to be observed by them, rather than place your fate in being appointed the nearest observer to you. You might get lucky and meet an enlightened observer but I wouldn't take that chance. You want someone who understands the bigger picture. Someone who has moved beyond IAM/RoADAR observer status. Believe me, it's entirely possible and I wouldn't doubt that someone from this forum will soon PM you with an offer to go for a drive. I can't thank those who did this for me enough because it helped me gain some perspective and ability, aside from meeting some very interesting people.

Hope this helps.

edited to correct spelling.

[martine]

Both the IAM and ROSPA training is done by a local group of volunteers. I suspect there is more variance between groups than there is between the IAM and ROSPA as organisations. ROSPA or the advanced driving bit called ROADAR, has around 10,000 members vs IAM's 90,000. As has been said there are plenty of examiners who do both organisations.

The IAM has around 200 groups nationally but this is reducing as HQ would like to have less, larger groups and are also making great attempts to 'standardise' the training of Observers and the course itself. ROADAR has 60 groups nationally and sadly the Avon group closed last year leaving a large gap in their coverage.

It is true to say the IAM course is more expensive than doing it the ROADAR way - probably by about £90 but I don't believe that should influence your decision as it pales into insignificance when compared to the running costs of a car and the importance of getting the right training from a group you are happy with.

Do Pass Plus as soon as you pass your L-test - it's a great way to extend your knowledge and experience but it's isn't what most people would call 'advanced'. I would suggest leaving IAM or ROADAR for a few months after that so you settle into driving by yourself and gain more experience of increasingly longer and more complex journeys - but try not to get into bad habits in the meantime.

Good luck!

[TheInsanity1234]

I fully intend on booking my driving instructor to do the entire Pass Plus within a week after my L-test.
Hopefully I'll be able to get a car of my own (depending on availability of funds), then I'd get IAM/RoDAR (depending on which makes more sense), then hopefully all shall be well.

[akirk]

I fully intend on booking my driving instructor to do the entire Pass Plus within a week after my L-test.
Hopefully I'll be able to get a car of my own (depending on availability of funds), then I'd get IAM/RoDAR (depending on which makes more sense), then hopefully all shall be well.

then hopefully the journey starts

Alasdair

[superplum]

Do Pass Plus as soon as you pass your L-test - it's a great way to extend your knowledge and experience but it's isn't what most people would call 'advanced'. I would suggest leaving IAM or ROADAR for a few months after that so you settle into driving by yourself and gain more experience of increasingly longer and more complex journeys - but try not to get into bad habits in the meantime.

As Martin suggests, wait a while before looking for AD training. You need to become comfortable on the road (rather than just confident) and that only comes with experience.

[jcochrane]

I would agree with the others that it is wise not to rush things and allow for a settling in time and to gain some driving mileage under your belt. However I think attending some ADUK driving days, as an observer, would be beneficial and give an insight of where you might wish to go with your driving. Also it would give you a chance to talk face to face with folk on here as to what routes are available for learning AD.

[waremark]

I would agree with the others that it is wise not to rush things and allow for a settling in time and to gain some driving mileage under your belt. However I think attending some ADUK driving days, as an observer, would be beneficial and give an insight of where you might wish to go with your driving. Also it would give you a chance to talk face to face with folk on here as to what routes are available for learning AD.

After Pass Plus, drive an experienced observer on an aduk day and then get a recommendation. Or meet up with one of us on a 1 to 1.

[TheInsanity1234]

If I'm honest, I'm unlikely to do AD shortly after passing my test anyway, as money will be jolly tight, because I'll have to pay out a decent chunk of money for a car and insurance, then I'll have to save up money so I've got a pool of money to cover fuel and unexpected expenses.

And then I've got to save money for university! (I'm a tight-fisted git anyway, so I'm not going to spend out a penny more than necessary)