20 limits (split from rodk introduction)

Forum for general chat, news, blogs, humour, jokes etc.

Postby Zebedee » Wed Aug 19, 2015 5:36 pm


Was my IAM training a waste of time? If what Martin posted (below) is true, then why did I bother with all that training?

martine wrote:The IAM insurer confirmed the following a few years ago...

  • IAM Car drivers have a similar number of claims but the claim value is smaller
  • IAM Bikers have an increased number and value of claims but their mileage is higher than the average


That makes very disappointing reading. Shouldn't the IAM Standards project being aiming to improve this?

Forget the endless debates about pull-push and BGOL. I want to know the main causes of accidents for advanced motorists and, consequently, what I can do to improve the odds of remaining accident-free.
Zebedee
 
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:52 pm

Postby martine » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:08 pm


Zebedee wrote:Was my IAM training a waste of time? If what Martin posted (below) is true, then why did I bother with all that training?

That makes very disappointing reading. Shouldn't the IAM Standards project being aiming to improve this?

Forget the endless debates about pull-push and BGOL. I want to know the main causes of accidents for advanced motorists and, consequently, what I can do to improve the odds of remaining accident-free.

Perhaps not as disappointing as you may think...the car drivers had less, serious claims but more low-speed, car-park type crunches. This may reflect the age profile!

The bikers were having less claims per mile travelled.
Martin - Bristol IAM: IMI National Observer and Group Secretary, DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)
martine
 
Posts: 4430
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:49 pm
Location: Bristol, UK




Postby Mr Cholmondeley-Warner » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:19 pm


martine wrote:more low-speed, car-park type crunches. This may reflect the age profile!


Chriskay - kill! :twisted: :evil:
User avatar
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner
 
Posts: 2928
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:03 am
Location: Swindon, Wilts




Postby Garrison » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:23 pm


Zebedee wrote:Was my IAM training a waste of time? If what Martin posted (below) is true, then why did I bother with all that training?

martine wrote:The IAM insurer confirmed the following a few years ago...

  • IAM Car drivers have a similar number of claims but the claim value is smaller
  • IAM Bikers have an increased number and value of claims but their mileage is higher than the average


That makes very disappointing reading. Shouldn't the IAM Standards project being aiming to improve this?

Forget the endless debates about pull-push and BGOL. I want to know the main causes of accidents for advanced motorists and, consequently, what I can do to improve the odds of remaining accident-free.

I think the insurance policies' composition may also have changed with IAM insurance.

I used to be with IAM insurance for my Mondeos (rep. mobile), Mazda6 MPS (quick, limited edition sedan) and just about squeeze in a S-Class. IAM insurance were getting uncomfortable with the S-Class due to my geography, age group and car value, but gave me a comparable quote to other insurers anyway. With my current MR2 and 911 Turbo, they point-blank refused to insure them by giving ridiculously high quotes.

If the IAM insurance are changing their policy profiles to bias towards low-value vehicles, they will of course pay less per policy/claim.

Is my thinking correct?
Garrison
 
Posts: 260
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 11:55 am
Location: London

Postby martine » Thu Aug 20, 2015 9:04 am


chriskay wrote:
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner wrote:
martine wrote:more low-speed, car-park type crunches. This may reflect the age profile!


Chriskay - kill! :twisted: :evil:


No, No, No; if I'm going to crash, it'll be at some considerable speed. :D

:lol:
But you are far from typical...a 'statistical outlier' if you will.
Martin - Bristol IAM: IMI National Observer and Group Secretary, DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)
martine
 
Posts: 4430
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:49 pm
Location: Bristol, UK




Postby TripleS » Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:38 pm


chriskay wrote:
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner wrote:
martine wrote:more low-speed, car-park type crunches. This may reflect the age profile!


Chriskay - kill! :twisted: :evil:


No, No, No; if I'm going to crash, it'll be at some considerable speed. :D


If I remember the incident anything like accurately:
Many moons ago at Mallory Park, Innes Ireland was doing a few demonstration laps in a newly introduced Mercedes model, a large saloon car then being run as personal transport by the Managing Director of Mercedes-Benz UK, or somesuch very senior person.

Anyhow, Innes Ireland being Innes Ireland, he lost it very comprehensively at Devil's Elbow, a fast downhill left hand bend leading onto the pits straight, and pranged the car in a highly spectacular fashion. After the dust had settled he was reported to have said: "When I have 'em, I have 'em big!" :lol:

Best wishes all,
Dave.
TripleS
 
Posts: 6025
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2005 9:47 pm
Location: Briggswath, Whitby

Postby Garrison » Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:55 pm


TripleS wrote:The system used around schools in Scotland seems to me to be far more sensible: the 20 mph limit only applies when the lights flash, which is probably for two fairly brief periods each weekday during term time.

Agree, same as in Melbourne. 30 kph zone around schools at prescribed times.

The thing is that I can avoid those areas in Melbourne at certain times in the day due to high hazards rate from school run traffic and lower 30 kph limits.

The problem with 20 mph across whole boroughs in London meant even trunk A-roads are down to 20 mph, which of course no one else follows due to lack of enforcement and that makes 20 mph limits useless. I guesstimate 99% of all traffic at 5-ish in the morning in the Camden borough breaks the 20 mph speed limit, based on my observation on my way to work every day.
Garrison
 
Posts: 260
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 11:55 am
Location: London

Postby TR4ffic » Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:02 pm


Mmmm. I do wonder why this road in Crewe has a 20mph limit.!? It's the main A534 running in to/out of Crewe - Wide road, wide pavements, non-residential, no parking...

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.0870341,-2.4470094,3a,75y,46.19h,84.9t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1ss53gp_-UC8SF22xSB49TKA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1?hl=en

...and because drivers see no need for it here they don't comply, which means they don't comply when they see another 20 limit even though they may actually be appropriate at that location - and I don't agree with 20 limits anyway, per se.
Riveting – The most fascinating job you could ever have..!

Nick
IAM Member since 1985
TR4ffic
 
Posts: 154
Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 3:47 pm
Location: Cheshire

Postby martine » Fri Aug 21, 2015 5:18 pm


Perhaps there are lots of cyclists, pedestrians crossing from one side to other for shops, perhaps the pubs/bars/clubs spill out onto the road at certain times of the day? Don't know...but their in lies the problem with 20s (in fact any speed limit)...it's appropriateness varies depending on time of day, weather etc and loads of other factors yet more and more roads are having restrictive speed limits put into place.

Driver Education: the only sustainable way to improve roads safety (hardly pithy but I feel like putting it on a t-shirt).
Martin - Bristol IAM: IMI National Observer and Group Secretary, DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)
martine
 
Posts: 4430
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:49 pm
Location: Bristol, UK




Postby Garrison » Fri Aug 21, 2015 5:54 pm


martine wrote:Driver Education: the only sustainable way to improve roads safety (hardly pithy but I feel like putting it on a t-shirt).

I don't think this concept will work hear. We are not Germans ...
Garrison
 
Posts: 260
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 11:55 am
Location: London

Postby Horse » Fri Aug 21, 2015 5:58 pm


martine wrote: Driver Education: the only sustainable way to improve roads safety (hardly pithy but I feel like putting it on a t-shirt).


You may be right. But educating them how and with what ideas? :?
Anything posted by 'Horse' may be (C) Malcolm Palmer. Please ask for permission before considering any copying or re-use outside of forum posting.
User avatar
Horse
 
Posts: 2811
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:40 pm
Location: Darkest Berkshoire

Postby martine » Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:23 pm


Horse wrote:
martine wrote: Driver Education: the only sustainable way to improve roads safety (hardly pithy but I feel like putting it on a t-shirt).


You may be right. But educating them how and with what ideas? :?

I'd start by DfT/DVSA actively promoting post-test training...they are somewhat half-hearted at the moment. I'd follow it up by a compulsory driving assessment (not test) with an ADI at the renewal of the driving licence (i.e. 10 years) - after making the photocard compulsory.

Some simple ideas could be pushed (ads, social media, bill boards): keep space in front, give driving 100% of your attention, more care when emerging from junctions etc.

We have to get the message across that passing the L-test is just the start of someone's driving career, not the end.

I'd bring in Graduated Driver Licensing in some form or another with restrictions lessoned if further training/tests are completed. Perhaps a higher-level licence for those who have taken extra training/tests with benefits (to be discussed!) officially recognised.

All ADI's to be advanced trained/tested.

More referrals to the 'National Driver Alertness Course' (NDAC) not just by police but by insurance companies if they identify a skills deficit (increased premium if you don't attend).

Just my thoughts.
Martin - Bristol IAM: IMI National Observer and Group Secretary, DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)
martine
 
Posts: 4430
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:49 pm
Location: Bristol, UK




Postby Horse » Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:45 pm


martine wrote: I'd start by DfT/DVSA actively promoting post-test training...


Stable door & bolted spring to mind. Why leave the important stuff until they have a licence?

martine wrote: Some simple ideas could be pushed (ads, social media, bill boards): keep space in front, give driving 100% of your attention, more care when emerging from junctions etc.


Sadly, I think there's very little evidence that such things work. 'Think bike' has been going in various forms for, what, 30 years? People still pull out in front of bikes as often as they did then.

martine wrote: We have to get the message across that passing the L-test is just the start of someone's driving career, not the end.


Most people just want a licence to get from A - B.

Not many are A - A drivers.

martine wrote: I'd bring in Graduated Driver Licensing in some form or another with restrictions lessoned if further training/tests are completed. Perhaps a higher-level licence for those who have taken extra training/tests with benefits (to be discussed!) officially recognised.


GDL seems to work - but there's little or no evidence that current 'advanced' training would make any difference.
Anything posted by 'Horse' may be (C) Malcolm Palmer. Please ask for permission before considering any copying or re-use outside of forum posting.
User avatar
Horse
 
Posts: 2811
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:40 pm
Location: Darkest Berkshoire

Postby Mr Cholmondeley-Warner » Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:15 pm


Horse wrote:Sadly, I think there's very little evidence that such things work. 'Think bike' has been going in various forms for, what, 30 years? People still pull out in front of bikes as often as they did then.

And what have bikers done in the meantime? Have they learnt to "Think car!"? Or do they still rush about in dark clothing presenting a small, non-foreshortening image, at an inappropriate speed differential? People don't deliberately pull out in front of bikes. They do it for one of only two reasons:

1. They didn't see the bike (see above).
2. They didn't appreciate the speed with which the bike was approaching (see above).

Just another point of view, you understand :wink:
User avatar
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner
 
Posts: 2928
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:03 am
Location: Swindon, Wilts




Postby Horse » Sat Aug 22, 2015 9:25 am


https://m.facebook.com/SurvivalSkills?r ... 41%2F&_rdr

Riders are too quick to blame drivers.
Anything posted by 'Horse' may be (C) Malcolm Palmer. Please ask for permission before considering any copying or re-use outside of forum posting.
User avatar
Horse
 
Posts: 2811
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:40 pm
Location: Darkest Berkshoire

PreviousNext

Return to General Car Chat Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests