A quick and somewhat embarrassing question!!!

[Micra Driver]

1. When parking the car, my driving instructor always said "handbrake on, into neutral, feet off pedals, engine off". Yet, when I asked him a few days before my test he was like "oh i always pop it in gear" which is fair enough, in case the handbrake fails bla bla. But why would he teach me to leave the car in neutral?

How would I select the gear? Do as above, but then slot it in 1st or reverse? Or would I just stop in my gear (normally 1st or 2nd) and then turn off the engine with the clutch still pressed in (as most of my family does)? I understand lower gear = better, something to do with the engine compression thing.

2. When trying to follow "the system" (bearing in mind, I have only mused through the Roadcraft book and watched the DVD once or twice, I have not taken any official advanced training as of yet) I am finding it hard to lose the brake-gear overlapping and separating everything out. I can do the system smoothly most of the time (rev matches when appropriate, braking in plenty of time etc) but sometimes I find myself braking again as I approach, say, a roundabout. Maybe that's lack of observation, but most of the time its small diddy town roundabouts where you can't really see what's approaching until you're mostly on top of the line. Should I be overlapping in such a scenario (safety over system etc)?

3. When trying to match revs, my father - a mechanic in the army - tells me to 'blip' the throttle, much like is shown on the Roadcraft dvd. Yet my uncle teaches me to keep my foot on the gas pedal and just work the clutch/gear stick to change gears. He calls it "constant throttle downshifting" (never heard of it myself). Both appear smooth, but which would be better?

Whew! Any help of the above would be appreciated!

[martine]

How would I select the gear? Do as above, but then slot it in 1st or reverse? Or would I just stop in my gear (normally 1st or 2nd) and then turn off the engine with the clutch still pressed in (as most of my family does)? I understand lower gear = better, something to do with the engine compression thing.

Don't think the sequence is important. Personally I don't leave it in gear - though I might if it were parked on a very steep hill. I guess if you were looking for the optimum gear I suppose the highest gear (5th) would be better as it would provide more resistance.

I'll let others answer your second/third question...but there is plenty of advice in the 'sticky' thread (BGOL - brake gear overlap).

[SammyTheSnake]

How would I select the gear? Do as above, but then slot it in 1st or reverse? Or would I just stop in my gear (normally 1st or 2nd) and then turn off the engine with the clutch still pressed in (as most of my family does)? I understand lower gear = better, something to do with the engine compression thing.

Don't think the sequence is important. Personally I don't leave it in gear - though I might if it were parked on a very steep hill. I guess if you were looking for the optimum gear I suppose the highest gear (5th) would be better as it would provide more resistance.

I have to leap in here. You *definitely* want the lowest gear available (same as when driving, the engine has the greatest effect on acceleration in the lowest gears) On the other hand, it'd have to be a pretty steep hill to make the engine turn over even in top gear.

On the subject of the "blip" vs. "sustained throttle" methods, whichever works for you has the advantage. The only significant part of it is that the engine speed matches what the new gear requires, what it does in the meantime is pretty much irrelevant.

Also, welcome to the forum, "Micra Driver"

Cheers & God bless
Sam "SammyTheSnake" Penny

[Nigel]

If, by driving instructor, you mean adi, and you are just learning to drive, don't even consider bgol, they teach you to actually overlap, and this is what is expected on your dsa test.

Get used to driving, have you passed your test yet ?

As far as the handbrake goes, I never trust them, I always leave the vehicle in first gear.

Avoiding brake & gear overlap is quite a useful skill to learn, as it will teach you to plan earlier, but in my humble opinion is one of the least transferable parts of advanced driving into everyday driving.

[James]

1. When parking the car, my driving instructor always said "handbrake on, into neutral, feet off pedals, engine off". Yet, when I asked him a few days before my test he was like "oh i always pop it in gear" which is fair enough, in case the handbrake fails bla bla. But why would he teach me to leave the car in neutral?

How would I select the gear? Do as above, but then slot it in 1st or reverse? Or would I just stop in my gear (normally 1st or 2nd) and then turn off the engine with the clutch still pressed in (as most of my family does)? I understand lower gear = better, something to do with the engine compression thing.

Only leave it in gear if there is a reason to, such as a slope or camber. Also think about pointing the wheels towards the curve, but watch for dry steering! Place it in gear after having turned off engine.

2. When trying to follow "the system" (bearing in mind, I have only mused through the Roadcraft book and watched the DVD once or twice, I have not taken any official advanced training as of yet) I am finding it hard to lose the brake-gear overlapping and separating everything out. I can do the system smoothly most of the time (rev matches when appropriate, braking in plenty of time etc) but sometimes I find myself braking again as I approach, say, a roundabout. Maybe that's lack of observation, but most of the time its small diddy town roundabouts where you can't really see what's approaching until you're mostly on top of the line. Should I be overlapping in such a scenario (safety over system etc)?

When you approach, plan to stop but look to go. So slow as you drive towards the line and then look for a chance to continue. One braking application, maybe a little later and a l little harder, or maybe a little more prolonged (hard to judge unless I see it), and treat at as a give way. If it is safe to merge once you reach the roundabout then merge. As for BGOL do not worry about using it when parking. You should be either reverse or 1st gear anyway and you may brake as and when you need during parking. Safety is a priority and does come above system.

3. When trying to match revs, my father - a mechanic in the army - tells me to 'blip' the throttle, much like is shown on the Roadcraft dvd. Yet my uncle teaches me to keep my foot on the gas pedal and just work the clutch/gear stick to change gears. He calls it "constant throttle downshifting" (never heard of it myself). Both appear smooth, but which would be better?

The wider, more accepted method is the former. Blipping the throttle is called "sustained revs" and matches engine speed to road speed. It is also the current method of police driver training. I have never heard of the other method.

[crr003]

Only leave it in gear if there is a reason to, such as a slope or camber.

Why not on the flat? I always leave in gear.

The wider, more accepted method is the former. Blipping the throttle is called "sustained revs" and matches engine speed to road speed. It is also the current method of police driver training. I have never heard of the other method.

Well, the defintion I've seen is different. Sustained revs (constant throttle) means leaving your right foot on the accelerator pretty much exactly where it was in say 4th gear, take neutral, engine revs naturally increase, take 3rd, drive on.
Blipping the throttle has been described as "agricultural" compared to sustaining, as the big application of the right foot overcomes the finesse required with sustained revs.
Even with sustained revs, there can be a slight modification to the throttle position, but it's supposed to be subtle.

[martine]

I have to leap in here. You *definitely* want the lowest gear available (same as when driving, the engine has the greatest effect on acceleration in the lowest gears)

Yes of course - don't know where that came from (can't even blame too much wine with the Sunday lunch!). Lowest gear is best.

[Micra Driver]

Wow! Thanks for the replies guys!

Also, welcome to the forum, "Micra Driver"

Cheers & God bless
Sam "SammyTheSnake" Penny

Thankyou, Sammy!

If, by driving instructor, you mean adi, and you are just learning to drive, don't even consider bgol, they teach you to actually overlap, and this is what is expected on your dsa test.

By instructor, I meant my driving instructor for the DSA test. "ADI", never heard that expression before

Get used to driving, have you passed your test yet ?

I have, thankfully, passed the DSA test and have been driving for about two years. I fear I have picked up many a "bad habbit" and am striving to get rid of them. I am still inexperienced when it comes to driving (obviously!!!) but the whole advanced driving thing really does appeal to me to making me a better driver.

I am yet to actually take an advanced course, but I am definately looking into it!

Only leave it in gear if there is a reason to, such as a slope or camber. Also think about pointing the wheels towards the curve, but watch for dry steering! Place it in gear after having turned off engine.

Dry steering? Not heard that one before... I assume its turning the wheel whilst stationary?

Why not on the flat? I always leave in gear.

Is this for extra security, or is it just habbit? My father always leaves his car in gear, but then again that is how he was taught how to do it in the army.

If I was to come to a stop (clutch pressed to the floor, footbrake on) and just apply the handbrake and engine off, would I be damaging anything?

[crr003]

I meant my driving instructor for the DSA test. "ADI", never heard that expression before

Approved Driving Instructor - if you paid him money, he has to be an ADI.

Why not on the flat? I always leave in gear.

Is this for extra security, or is it just habbit? My father always leaves his car in gear, but then again that is how he was taught how to do it in the army.

Both I suppose. What happens if the handbrake cable snaps in the night and your car rolls away into another car/house/river........
It's just not worth the risk!
I also have a car I don't use all the time and I only leave it in gear - no handbrake at all. Saves the brakes binding on.

If I was to come to a stop (clutch pressed to the floor, footbrake on) and just apply the handbrake and engine off, would I be damaging anything?

Don't think so.

[Nigel]

If you want to look at advanced driving there are two basic, affordable courses, the IAM : http://www.iam.org.uk/ , and Rospa : http://www.roada.org.uk/

They both teach the same thing, at a similar cost, and use similar methods (being assigned an instructor to coach you to standard)

Which is best will depend very much on your local group for either, both have good & not so good groups.

If you post what area your from, you may even have someone on here from that area who can advise you further.

I'd suggest you leave your car in gear, as I have had handbrakes "come off" whilst stationary, even in modern vehicles, these have always been Vauxhalls, but for the extra effort involved by leaving it in gear....its just that bit safer.

ADI is an approved driving instructor, which anyone that teaches you for payment must be, your advanced instructors are unlikely to be adi's, as they teach on a voluntary basis, which is why the courses are so cheap.

Dry steering is turning your wheels whilst the cars is stationary.

[crr003]

Dry steering? Not heard that one before... I assume its turning the wheel whilst stationary?

Correct. Try not to apply steering when stationary on a hard surface. It can strain the steering bits, and damage the tyres. I saw a Peugot front tyre explode in Tescos car park once and the driver was dry steering........

[Gareth]

Some cars have handbrakes which operate the disk brakes - if the the disk is warm when the handbrake is put on, then when the metal cools and contracts, the car may not be so firmly held.

There are two common strategies for dealing with this that are especially useful when parking on a slope. These are also useful for cars in which the handbrake is particularly ineffective.

The first is to put the car in a low gear when the engine has been switched off, either first or reverse depending on the direction of roll. The idea is that the compression of the engine acts as an additional brake, but you need to be careful about which gear is selected because a few engines get very arsey, (i.e. potentially expensive bills), when rotated in the wrong direction! So reverse gear for facing uphill, and first or second for facing downhill.

The second is to turn the front wheels such that if the car rolls, it moves the smallest distance before the wheels hit the curb. That is, if facing downhill, the front wheels should be turned as if for steering into the kerb, and vice versa for facing uphill.

[Micra Driver]

Awww excellent! You guys rule!

To fill in the blanks, at the moment i drive a Nissan Micra (who would have thought, eh? ) K10 model It's a hand-me-down car, which is due to be replaced in the new year.

Anyhoo.. thanks for the advice guys, it has been a definate help!

As for my location, I am from Wiltshire (from a small town called Trowbridge, in Wiltshire). Anyone know of any advanced instructors/groups in my area?

[James]

Only leave it in gear if there is a reason to, such as a slope or camber.

Why not on the flat? I always leave in gear.

The wider, more accepted method is the former. Blipping the throttle is called "sustained revs" and matches engine speed to road speed. It is also the current method of police driver training. I have never heard of the other method.

Well, the defintion I've seen is different. Sustained revs (constant throttle) means leaving your right foot on the accelerator pretty much exactly where it was in say 4th gear, take neutral, engine revs naturally increase, take 3rd, drive on.
Blipping the throttle has been described as "agricultural" compared to sustaining, as the big application of the right foot overcomes the finesse required with sustained revs.
Even with sustained revs, there can be a slight modification to the throttle position, but it's supposed to be subtle.

I would never just leave my right foot stationary. It gives the required amount of throttle to match engine speed sufficiently for a smooth gear change. You could leave it on I suppose but I require more flexibilty than that.

[PeteG]

I had a K10 Micra till March, when I joined the dark side of Corsa ownership... Terrific for a first vehicle, never let me down once.