Lincolnshire roads

[Nigel]

I've been up in Lincolshire today, not a normal event for me (not many customers over that way), I've driven from Worcester, to Louth, then to Skegmess, then back to Worcester.

The saftey brigade have made the roads I used an absolute nightmare, they are the worst I've come across so far.

What obviously were normal "A" road nsl's, houses no closer than a quarter of a mile, now a 30 mph limit, time and time again.

They don't seem to be able to go nsl to 30, its nsl, 50, 40, 30, then back up again

Specs, truvello & gatso's everywhere.

I'm shattered , which I normally wouldn't be from a drive of that length, and I've spent by far too much time looking for scameras, it seemed like speed limit changes every few hundred yards.

What are they trying to achieve ?

[crr003]

I've been up in Lincolshire today, .........
Specs, truvello & gatso's everywhere...........
What are they trying to achieve ?

Sorry for your experience.
Maybe they have read or should read this:
http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/d ... 612262.pdf
Appendix D

[Nigel]

The important points here are :

I was trying to stick to speed limits at all times....I generally do.

I spent far too much of my observation time looking for speed limit changes and scameras, it was a horrid day, bad weather, mud all over the roads, and what am I forced to do ?....look for stupid speed limit changes !

Its getting silly now, and in todays case was detracting from my ability to drive the car correctley and consideratley.

[7db]

Its getting silly now, and in todays case was detracting from my ability to drive the car correctley and consideratley.

Surely you mean that it was an opportunity to show that your careful and considerate car control was so bedded-in that you could spend your time looking at the speed-limit changes?

[Nigel]

No , I wish I could say that.

The roads were filthy, so constantly having to keep the windscreen clear, the roads in that part of the world can be at best frustrating when you trying to get somewhere.

Its been a strange sort of day, not one of my better ones as far as the driving experience goes.

Some of the limits were ludicrous, that was the real problem, apart from looking out for signs, you'd never guess some of them were 30's, they were the worst I've seen, very poor repeater frequency.

I felt I was spending far too much of my time protecting my licence, time that should have been spent driving the car.

[James]

Its a good reflection of how difficult driving is, in many different ways, ie the drive, the camera scan, the cop car scan, the speed limit scan, monitering speedo and all whilst driving to the system and giving commentary!

[Gareth]

Its a good reflection of how difficult driving is, in many different ways, ie the drive, the camera scan, the cop car scan, the speed limit scan, monitering speedo and all whilst driving to the system and giving commentary!

Forgetting about the commentary, are we as a society making driving too difficult for people who's only training has been to get them through the DSA test?

I've come across a number of people who find driving quite hard or stressful and as a consequence are unwilling to use unfamilar roads, and some won't even use motorways. If you consider the increased likelihood of putting a licence at risk, it's perhaps not surprising.

[TripleS]

....are we as a society making driving too difficult for people who's only training has been to get them through the DSA test?

If Nigel can find things difficult and frustrating today, what the hell are the poorer drivers going to make of it all? They are likely to be so overloaded with the task of keeping tabs on the multitude of speed limit changes, and camera spotting, that their attention to safe driving is bound to be jeopardised.

....and/or they'll end up with an assortment of speeding tickets - and all to no useful purpose.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[Angus]

When we visited Skegness in the summer we were very strongly advised to not use the A16 between Louth & Skeggy and the A52 south from Skeggy. Apparently the locals hate what has been done to these roads & avoid them like the plague.

Fortuneately there are good B road alternatives (if you have a navigator )

[Nigel]

Strangely enough Angus, those were two of the roads I was on !

[Søren]

Its getting silly now, and in todays case was detracting from my ability to drive the car correctley and consideratley.

Surely you mean that it was an opportunity to show that your careful and considerate car control was so bedded-in that you could spend your time looking at the speed-limit changes?

I think that while driving, the road (condition, hazard density etc) tells us just about everything we need to know for our drive. Signs and much roadside furniture are passed almost subliminally unless you know that you are looking for assistance from a sign.
You could argue that we should pay much more attention to road signs, but we generally don't. Unless you have undertaken some form of advanced driving instruction, most people wouldn't be able to tell you what sign you had just passed (especialy if it bore no direct relevance to their journey).

This is why motorists will slow down to 30 when in a 40 mph or 50mph or sometimes even 60mph NSL when they see a camera on an unfamiliar road, because they then question their observations. It's not observational negligence, it's just normal safe driving behaviours causing the quandary.
But we are encouraged to feel guilty about this - "If you can't see a speed limit/camera sign should you be driving?" It's a nonsense philosophy. We generally see what we need to see.
We drive for 10 million miles between serious collisions, yet if we closed our eyes for 10 seconds when driving, we'd doubtless crash.

[Susie]

Nigel, why not voice (or write) your concerns to the Lincolnshire Road Safety Partnership. Google and you'll find links to both the police and the partnership sites. Also put in a Google for Greville Burgess. There's a pdf on his background and he is/was the main man.

Lincolnshire has a high proportion of Ks and SIs. There are flatlands with dykes; upsy-downsy bits which are affected by ice in winter; twisty bits and wide straight roads used by the agricultural lorries delivering the British public its sugar and veggies. The majority of crashes are single vehicle, ran-out-of-talent incidents. The figures for the last year have also been skewed by a couple of multiple fatals. The one in February when six died happened less than a mile from our house.

After the 6 x FATAC in February, the MP for Grantham demanded that all the bends were straightened. The BBC reporter repeatedly said the crash happened because Lincolnshire had a lot of dangerous bends.

There is (more than) a hint that Lincolnshire will be the first to implement the blanket 40 policy, regardless of road type.

Regards
S

[7db]

There is (more than) a hint that Lincolnshire will be the first to implement the blanket 40 policy, regardless of road type.

Should make the MDC a little easier...

[Nigel]

Susie.

I did notice lots of signs telling me about accidents, on supposed "red routes", slight northern twist to red route, up there it seems to mean accident blackspots.

The signs are badly designed, so you can't really read & take in the information on offer, but from the couple I did make out it seems the accident rate is going up.....so these stupid measures don't seem to be working.

[SammyTheSnake]

There is (more than) a hint that Lincolnshire will be the first to implement the blanket 40 policy, regardless of road type.

Should make the MDC a little easier...

Many candidates for what MDC means but "Most Dangerous Corner" is the only one that halfway makes sense in the context, but that's only half way. Is there another meaning?

Maybe they have read or should read this:
http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_rdsafety/documents/page/dft_rdsafety_612262.pdf

One interesting point I spotted in this was a definition of "acceptable risk". Apparently it depends on whether the route is an "upper tier road" or a "lower tier road." The definition is 35 or 60 "injury accidents" per 100 million vehicle km (presumably "injury accident" is a little more common than a KSI because it would include non-serious injuries)

Cheers & God bless
Sam "SammyTheSnake" Penny