ADUK Archive

Hi everyone, posting this on behalf of my daughter who has had 5 lessons so far.

Her instructor is teaching the stopping procedure as being, out of gear and then handbrake on. I am an advanced driving instructor with the ambulance service and have always taught make the car safe first by handbrake applied, then out of gear next.

I've spoken to him tonight to try and understand why he would be teaching this way, and he states that for the purposes of a test it doesn't matter. I explained that if you don't apply the handbrake first to make car safe, and are only holding it on footbrake and get rear ended, the first thing that happens is that your foot slips off the footbrake, the car jumps forward and potentially knocks over a child.

I wonder whether I need to look at some retraining - last course 3 years ago, but even then system of car control was specific in the method to be used as being handbrake first then out of gear.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Your area of the world totally flat then?

Find a different instructor?

I would be wary of any instructor whose opinion on anything is "it doesn't matter". He may have reasons but if he can't/won't justify them, I'd look elsewhere

sherlock wrote:Her instructor is teaching the stopping procedure as being, out of gear and then handbrake on.

Not the way I teach it. I agree with you. Handbrake, then neutral. Check whether he has a green badge. If not he could be a trainee with an orangey pink badge, (I am colour blind). That's not to say that a trainee will be a poor instructor though.

Appreciate your comments Angus and Fungus, and have to say I agree with you. My concern was maybe I had missed out on some recent update as to a stopping procedure sequence, but even if there had been, I couldn't possibly think of anything that would explain, what was to me, basically an unsafe procedure.

Wanted to be sure I wasn't in the minority or wrong even before binning someone without good and proper reason.

Handbrake then neutral/first is the procedure for 'long stops' and is what I teach to learners. Advanced have the option of 'short stops' of 'gear before handbrake' (GBH) but that's just confusing for raw learners.

No instructor (or observer) should try and dismiss a question without explaining the thinking behind it...that's not to say everything has a clear cut answer but they should explain the pros/cons and options.

Thanks Martin,

That was my thinking. I teach GBH but only on the advanced rapid response courses to drivers who are of a high standard and are only doing a 'short stop'.

I couldn't think of any reason why an instructor would teach anything other than handbrake and neutral to a raw beginner, otherwise my thinking is they are only instilling bad habits from an early stage in their driving career.

My suspicions were also raised with the comment "it doesn't really matter for the test". I'm pretty damn sure that using anything other than the system of handbrake and then gear would be a fail for unsafe control of the vehicle.

Handbrake before gear.

Dom

sherlock wrote:I'm pretty damn sure that using anything other than the system of handbrake and then gear would be a fail for unsafe control of the vehicle.

Not so sure about that, actually...might be a minor or 2...there is an ex-DSA examiner lurking here...perhaps they'd like to comment?

always hand brake before neutral and gear before hand brake for me.

I have to agree that the correct "official" DSA approach is handbrake and neutral.

However as far as I recall our local examiners take the line that doing it the other way is not a fault as long as the process used is safe, and does not lead the candidate into the bad habit of popping into neutral before stopping (I was always led to believe that the reason why handbrake then gear is the preferred approach is that it reduces the risk of that bad habit developing). I cannot say if that is a local policy or part of official DSA line.

Thanks Michael,

Given the wealth of almost overwhelming 'evidence' that the method I had told her to use, i.e. handbrake and then intro neutral to make the car safe, and to stop any bad habits forming, was the opposite to that taught by her instructor, (out of gear and then handbrake applied) I have decided its now time to look elsewhere for a new instructor to continue her training.

Seems a bit harsh if this is the only fault.

Well it may well appear harsh, but if its not the only fault, and bear in mind this is someone I'm paying good money to as a trained professional, do I wait to find out when my daughter fails her test due to the bad habits which should never have been taught in the first place!

What concerned me more was the failure to provide any reasonable explanation as to why a departure from the much proven safe system of car control had been utilised when stopping a vehicle at the side of the road, by using gear intro neutral then applying handbrake.

I am a little surprised that you seem more bothered about her possibly failing her test than about whether she is learning to be a good driver.

It would probably have been a good idea to change instructors anyway but since you have lost confidence in this one it is now certainly a good idea.