Midas Minibus Training

[steven_minibus]

The MiDAS scheme is a funny old animal, which I'm surprised is still allowed to continue

Why...

The duty of care and driving standards required to drive a minibus are far higher from that of a car... would you agree?

Then instructing/assessing or training someone who drives a minibus should require the instructor or supervising driver themselves to be of a higher professional and competent standard from lets say someone who just passed their normal car driving test!

So why is it that the MiDAS scheme is allowed to appoint drivers without ADI qualifications, PCV D1 entitlements (not pre 97 car drivers but those who have passed a separate test) act as trainers/assessors of car-licence holding minibus drivers, when they don't have any professional qualifications themselves?

Furthermore, I'm not alone on this issue as the DSA (Driving Standards Agency) have raised their concerns with drivers who only hold a car licence who are acting as minibus instructors, trainers or assessors. From April 2010, new laws will help prevent this unsafe practice.

Look at this this way, would you trust someone to fix a wiring problem if they were not an electrician?
Similarly, would you gamble the lives of passengers or loved ones, with a so-called instructor if they at least couldn't even pass the DSA minibus driving test themselves???

Absolute Madness!!!

[ROG]

Then instructing/assessing or training someone who drives a minibus should require the instructor or supervising driver themselves to be of a higher professional and competent standard from lets say someone who just passed their normal car driving test!

I have 2 successful years under my belt as a non DSA LGV instructor and over 10 years as a senior observer so where does that put me with no paper qualifications

[steven_minibus]

I have 2 successful years under my belt as a non DSA LGV instructor and over 10 years as a senior observer so where does that put me with no paper qualifications

Well, if your a DSA LGV instructor then you are a qualified professional. ...and on a personal note thats good enough for me.

However, the MiDAS scheme does not recognise this qualification as an exception if you want a MiDAS driver certificate (for what it's worth) and therefore you will have to be assessed by someone who could only hold a car licence.

How does that insult your professional qualifications?

[ROG]

Well, if your a DSA LGV instructor then you are a qualified professional

NO - I am not DSA qualified but can do the job just as well as those that are - results and comments from trainees & DSA examiners reflect that.

Where does that leave me as I have no paper quals

[ExadiNigel]

....However, the MiDAS scheme does not recognise this qualification as an exception if you want a MiDAS driver certificate (for what it's worth) and therefore you will have to be assessed by someone who could only hold a car licence.

How does that insult your professional qualifications?

Must admit I couldn't really care whether the trainer only had a car licence or not. It is how the trainer comes across with subject knowledge and their ability to get the info across. It would be good if they were also able to demo any manoeuvres that a trainee might struggle with.

The time I attended a MIDAS course I came out with little respect for the trainer. We came to the subject of turning a minibus around. Absolutely no mention of considering the right reverse as a valid means of turning the vehicle around and the trainer gave me the impression she had never heard of the manoeuvre!

Nigel

[Pip]

My company used to put any of it's staff who were driving our vans on tours through a MiDAS course as a kind of 'best practice' thing to get them used to driving vehicles of this size. They aren't actually minibuses, but as LWB Sprinters, a similar size to the average minibus.

Not knowing much about the MiDAS system I thought this was a great idea (So often in my industry you'll just be chucked the keys to a tour van and told to get on with it - even if the biggest thing you've ever driven is a Mini).......until I discovered the instructor had been feeding our staff the wrong speed limits for our vans, and had actually fallen asleep during one of the 'assessment' drives! Not desperately professional really....

I remain to be convinced of the MiDAS system. I can see why it's there, otherwise community minibuses etc would have to find people with D1 licences, but in my book if you're driving a minibus full of people you need to have the same level of skill no matter whether the people on board are fare paying passengers or not.

[ExadiNigel]

Hi Pip,

A better scheme to consider for your tour van drivers would be the SAFED scheme. pm me your phone number if you want any info and we can have a chat.

Nigel

[ROG]

Hi Pip,

A better scheme to consider for your tour van drivers would be the SAFED scheme. pm me your phone number if you want any info and we can have a chat.

Nigel

If you do a SAFED course then make sure that the instructor is an advanced driver because I know of a few non-advanced drivers who put fuel economy over safety when teaching SAFED

[ExadiNigel]

Hi Pip,

A better scheme to consider for your tour van drivers would be the SAFED scheme. pm me your phone number if you want any info and we can have a chat.

Nigel

If you do a SAFED course then make sure that the instructor is an advanced driver because I know of a few non-advanced drivers who put fuel economy over safety when teaching SAFED

I'm only a short trip along the motorway!

[mickjane2]

Hi my question is is the MIDAS really fit for purpose, let me explain I joined a local charity CT scheme as a driver/mechanic three years ago and they insisted that all drivers had to pass the Midas assessment before they could be let loose behind the wheel. The senior MIDAS instructor new I was an ADI and asked if I would watch him do a few drIrving assessments and give him my views of the way he did his job. Leaving aside the passenger/wheel chair side the driving assessment was well below par, on one drive I witnessed a near collision very little use of mirrors total lack of use of hand brake (except when parked) mounting kerbs and the signalling wasn't worth bothering with and yes she still passed. When I asked why I was told he didn't want her to loos her job. He asked me to observe him doing a test route and give him some observations on his driving (a very brave man), I used a DSA test sheet and marked him accordingly. He told me he did the drive to the best of his ability and where it wasn't exactly dangerous it wasn't legal either i.e. crossing solid white line to join traffic, didn't notice change of speed limit on three occasions (30 to 20) wrong lane and incorrect signalling on roundabouts no H/brake at pedestrian crossings and again little or no use of mirrors. After the test I gave him my opinions and asked what was his criteria was for passing the assessment and he replied as long as it didn't look dangerous (in his eyes) they would pass. As an ADI who had to have proper training and at great expense to my self how can the DSA support such a crazy way of assessing any kind of driver let alone someone who would be transporting up-to fifteen passengers is beyond me. Sorry for my rant but C/T schemes use this to generate revenue by alleged training of teaching staff at variousness schools and other charities. Mick

[RobC]

Anyone providing Midas training on a commercial basis (ie paid specifically for driver training) should be an ADI. I work with several MIDAS DATs and all are well qualified and are professional.
Personally I do not know of any senior Midas trainers who don't hold appropriate driving qualifications though I guess there are the good the bad and the ugly in any profession.