A wrong/dangerous sense of politeness!?

Discussion on Advanced and Defensive Driving.

Postby GJD » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:57 pm


MGF wrote:... reducing speed a little within the limit to create a sufficiently large gap.

Bringing free-flowing traffic behind you to a halt to enable traffic to join or cross...


I think those are the two ends of the spectrum in the middle of which is a grey area with scope for differing opinion.
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Postby MGF » Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:11 pm


Of course, what is inconsiderate to one person may not be considered inconsiderate to another but inconsiderate driving is not made considerate because it is done to be courteous to non-priority traffic. That much I am sure of.
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Postby TripleS » Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:53 pm


MGF wrote:Of course, what is inconsiderate to one person may not be considered inconsiderate to another but inconsiderate driving is not made considerate because it is done to be courteous to non-priority traffic. That much I am sure of.


By 'eck, I wish just once in a while I could find summat to be sure of. :(

Best wishes all,
Dave.
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Postby Horse » Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:48 pm


TripleS wrote: By 'eck, I wish just once in a while I could find summat to be sure of. :(


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.
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Postby Gareth » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:49 pm


MGF wrote:Bringing free-flowing traffic behind you to a halt to enable traffic to join or cross is inconsiderate unless necessary for safety reasons.

I completely agree, and use it as a basis for my decisions.

If I must stop because of traffic queuing after a junction I stop before the junction with the aim of allowing one vehicle to join my direction of traffic when the queue starts to clear. A beneficial side effect is that it may allow multiple vehicles to emerge for travel in the other direction, and it may allow on-coming vehicles to turn into the minor road.

If there is an obstruction in the road such that traffic can only flow in one direction at a time, and if there is a bit of a gap ahead and I can see a long queue on the other side, I generally won't rush to join the tail. On the other hand I am very assertive about plonking myself into the first available on-coming gap, then going slowly until I see I have the co-operation of the next on-coming vehicle.

Pretty much that's it. I generally don't slow down to allow others to join the main flow of traffic, but neither do I speed up to block them from doing so if they feel they are able to accelerate quickly enough, (and I strongly hope they aren't going to hang about if they are cheekily joining).
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Postby GJD » Tue Jun 26, 2012 11:52 pm


Gareth wrote:If there is an obstruction in the road such that traffic can only flow in one direction at a time, and if there is a bit of a gap ahead and I can see a long queue on the other side, I generally won't rush to join the tail. On the other hand I am very assertive about plonking myself into the first available on-coming gap, then going slowly until I see I have the co-operation of the next on-coming vehicle.


Does you approach differ much depending on which side of the road the obstruction is on?

Gareth wrote:Pretty much that's it. I generally don't slow down to allow others to join the main flow of traffic, but neither do I speed up to block them from doing so if they feel they are able to accelerate quickly enough, (and I strongly hope they aren't going to hang about if they are cheekily joining).


I don't think I slow down to allow others to join either, but I might deliberately accelerate a little more gently to allow a gap that has begun to appear ahead of me to develop into one big enough to allow someone to join.

The only situation that comes to mind where I am sometimes tempted to slow is when I'm in a moving queue with no sign of a natural break behind me and an oncomer waiting to turn right across my path is blocking the oncoming lane, causing a stationary queue to build behind them. In that situation, while I accept that easing off early to create a gap for them to cross my path amounts to a deliberate decision on my part to reverse the rules of priority, it can feel like causing a brief, minor inconvenience to those behind me (for a short time I would cause them to have to travel slightly slower than they otherwise could) might not be unreasonable in order to relieve the more major inconvenience (being blocked from moving at all) being suffered by those stuck behind the oncomer who is waiting to turn.

If I'm turning left into the same road as the oncomer is turning right, I'd probably give serious though to timing my approach so as give the oncomer room to turn in front of me.
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Postby Gareth » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:26 am


GJD wrote:Does you approach differ much depending on which side of the road the obstruction is on?

Not greatly, although when I wrote earlier I was simplifying slightly as there are many factors that could come into play.

One example is when I wait to cross a local bridge. Just beyond the bridge vehicles park on the offside such that we must take it in turns to pass that section, but beyond that there is very little space for waiting vehicles, so if I move forward even when I could it might snarl up that further section so that it takes longer for everyone. By waiting I allow space for me to develop, and then I am able to pass more easily.

For the situation I described previously, it seems to me that motorists should treat the road as a shared space and play nicely with each other, so I might let the opposing queue reduce before, as I said before, inserting myself into the first available gap, (and making it clear that now it's my turn).
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Postby apple tango » Wed Jun 27, 2012 1:37 pm


When the roads are quiet then I do not create opportunities for others. There's no need, they can wait until there is a suitable gap in the traffic.

When the roads are busy then I will try to create opportunities for others but not at the cost of disrupting the traffic flow or creating danger.

For instance in slow moving traffic, if I can see a junction on the left with someone waiting to emerge then I will try to hold back and create space for them to use. It's up to them to take it, I do not flash my headlights nor beckon them out, and if they don't take the opportunity then I just keep moving. By "holding back" I mean not accelerating as quickly as the car in front, or perhaps just easing off the throttle slightly, but in a way that the traffic behind me won't even feel the effects. I won't slow dramatically or brake to make an opportunity.

I witnessed my dad with a "dangerous sense of politeness" last week... travelling on a high speed wide open country road, junction on the left with an oncoming car waiting to turn right across our path. He flashed the oncoming car but it didn't move. He flashed again, and still nothing. He ended up braking hard until we were almost stopped, all the time flashing the other car until the driver finally got the hint and went. I made a comment along the lines of "that's why I never flash other motorists because it makes you feel compelled to stop when they don't do what you expect", and because of the danger that this courteousness had created. Didn't stop him flashing somebody else out of a junction 10 minutes later... :roll:
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