ADUK Archive

vonhosen wrote:

martine wrote:

vonhosen wrote:...instead of the people who I do ride/drive with in my spare time.

So who's that then?

A group of friends & acquaintances who have an interest in & obtain enjoyment from riding/driving who are not a formal club.

So go on tell us then, this interest, is it about the scenic views on the ride/drive, the destination, or a touch of peer to peer mentoring?
Perhaps all?

WhoseGeneration wrote:So go on tell us then, this interest, is it about the scenic views on the ride/drive, the destination, or a touch of peer to peer mentoring?
Perhaps all?

Sometimes all three at the same time, but very often the road & the ride/drive.

Gareth wrote:

Ralge wrote:Some time ago I thought " I'll go and learn something from the IAM" but I was turned off 'ordinary' membership by the apparent rigid inflexibility of a 12-week course and fee (no recognition of prior experience or qualifications).

Why didn't you just pay the test fee and do the test instead?

What form did you think recognition of prior experience and qualifications should take? Would taking the test directly without getting involved with a local group have satisfied you in this regard?

Course delivery is in the hands of the volunteer local group; different groups have tended to have different arrangements.

I didn't do the test on its own since:
- I wanted to learn something from the process
- the local IAM examiner is my local RoSPA examiner who I've had 3 times (and we've had business contact in between).
Maybe all I wanted was some input from another angle and a flexible response from IAM (a couple of sessions with a Senior Observer?) prior to a test would have given me this. The inflexibility of the (12-week course) response put me off.
Maybe I'll get a different response next time with an interest in the Masters.

Ralge wrote:

Gareth wrote:

Ralge wrote:Some time ago I thought " I'll go and learn something from the IAM" but I was turned off 'ordinary' membership by the apparent rigid inflexibility of a 12-week course and fee (no recognition of prior experience or qualifications).

Why didn't you just pay the test fee and do the test instead?

What form did you think recognition of prior experience and qualifications should take? Would taking the test directly without getting involved with a local group have satisfied you in this regard?

Course delivery is in the hands of the volunteer local group; different groups have tended to have different arrangements.

I didn't do the test on its own since:
- I wanted to learn something from the process
- the local IAM examiner is my local RoSPA examiner who I've had 3 times (and we've had business contact in between).
Maybe all I wanted was some input from another angle and a flexible response from IAM (a couple of sessions with a Senior Observer?) prior to a test would have given me this. The inflexibility of the (12-week course) response put me off.
Maybe I'll get a different response next time with an interest in the Masters.

Or try a different group - a standard 12 week coursse is more likely an exception than the rule.
Or talk to someone at your local group and let them know that you are a veteran of Rospa, and you are just looking for a cross check with a different Observer.

But in view of your Rospa history, it is likely that you are in fact the candidate at whom Masters is aimed.

waremark wrote: ... in view of your Rospa history, it is likely that you are in fact the candidate at whom Masters is aimed.

+1.

Ralge, you appear to be an ideal fit for the Masters programme. (Whereas I doubt you'd get much out of Skills for Life, because your RoSPA qualifications indicate you're way past 'basic' IAM level.)

I did the car Masters last Saturday - really enjoyed it & not just because I scored 84%.
The marking is fairly critical and any little thing gets picked up.
I lost marks on:
1- not quite using the full road to extend view on country lanes
2- not checking rear mirror every time before braking
3- on one occasion, approaching a car pulling out of a driveway, left gear selection a bit late
4- once didn't check r/h mirror before pulling out for parked cars.

Having done RoSPA Gold, it's a significantly higher standard than that and a whole lot higher than normal IAM.
As an IAM NO, I've seen folk pass who were marginal at best, although recently it feels like the standard has been raised a bit.
In the final reckoning for IAM, members = revenue > they're not gonna raise the bar too high.

John @ Banbury

Well done John493.

It's an exhilarating experience!

I've done Masters with distinction and am looking to do NO soon - back to front you may say - any tips on how best to prepare?

Congratulations!

What an excellent thread this is. As a personal note of thanks to all who have contributed to it, it's very apt for me to be able to read these sage words, as i'm considering my next regular step in AD. I have some work to do and the views being expressed here, are a goldmine of information and insights to folk such as me and makes the decision of which route to take much easier, so thanks for that.

john493 wrote:I did the car Masters last Saturday - really enjoyed it & not just because I scored 84%.
The marking is fairly critical and any little thing gets picked up.
I lost marks on:
1- not quite using the full road to extend view on country lanes
2- not checking rear mirror every time before braking
3- on one occasion, approaching a car pulling out of a driveway, left gear selection a bit late
4- once didn't check r/h mirror before pulling out for parked cars.

Having done RoSPA Gold, it's a significantly higher standard than that and a whole lot higher than normal IAM.
As an IAM NO, I've seen folk pass who were marginal at best, although recently it feels like the standard has been raised a bit.
In the final reckoning for IAM, members = revenue > they're not gonna raise the bar too high.

John @ Banbury

Were the comments re: missed obs as a result of a 'space' in your commentary, or from the examiner's observations?

Also, could you post a Google maps link to where you didn't use enough road width?

Well done John.

3- on one occasion, approaching a car pulling out of a driveway, left gear selection a bit late

As opposed to 'right' gear selection? Oh...I see what you mean.

I think it's great the IAM have introduced a higher level test and it seems to have captured more interest than the old 'Special Assessment' ever did. With the IAM 'modules' they've introduced a lower level of training as well...quite a nice spread now of 'products'.
* IAM Modules (motorway, manoeuvring, lone-driver, in-car tech, winter driving, distractions)
* Drivecheck (for non-members)
* Skill for Life (pass and F1rst)
* Driving Assessment (for members)
* Skill for Life
* Masters

Not forgetting IMI National Observer for those so inclined.

I wonder if they could introduce a 2-tier membership...those that have had a retest in the last 5 years and those that haven't...

Well done john493, the items picked up by your Masters examiner seem pretty minor. I was particularly interested though in "not checking rear mirror every time before braking". How did the examiner know? I obtain a clear view in my interior mirror (and driver's side door mirror) simply by moving my eyes with no head movement needed at all. Is it recommended that an unnecessary head movement is made so that an examiner is sure the mirror hasn't been forgotten or is it best handled by commentary?

Tim

I would recommend a head movement, not to ensure that the examiner is in no doubt about the check(s) but to ensure direct (rather than peripheral) vision of what's there to be seen.
If your driving can't accommodate a move of the head, use commentary to convince that you know what's following (but do you know what risks are posed to you by those near-siders without turning your head to the near side door mirror?)
I have always felt more comfortable sat next to a driver who updates him/herself with a width and depth of scanning that is made effortless by keeping head, eyes and focus moving.

Ralge wrote:I would recommend a head movement [...] to ensure direct (rather than peripheral) vision.

I have always felt more comfortable sat next to a driver who [...] keep[s] head, eyes and focus moving.

I agree about the importance of keeping one's head and eyes moving, but I find that peripheral vision is more useful than you suggest. In fact, peripheral vision can be better at picking up those movements that then direct the driver to take a closer look.

An IAM associate I've been working with has recently passed his test, and was given an excellent mark for his observation, but only "satisfactory" for his use of the mirrors. I wonder how that can be? He has assured me that there was no time during the test when he was caught out by what was behind, so perhaps the examiner was looking for head movements rather than assessing his overall awareness and planning?

David

kfae8959 wrote:

Ralge wrote:I would recommend a head movement [...] to ensure direct (rather than peripheral) vision.

I have always felt more comfortable sat next to a driver who [...] keep[s] head, eyes and focus moving.

I agree about the importance of keeping one's head and eyes moving, but I find that peripheral vision is more useful than you suggest. In fact, peripheral vision can be better at picking up those movements that then direct the driver to take a closer look.

An IAM associate I've been working with has recently passed his test, and was given an excellent mark for his observation, but only "satisfactory" for his use of the mirrors. I wonder how that can be? He has assured me that there was no time during the test when he was caught out by what was behind, so perhaps the examiner was looking for head movements rather than assessing his overall awareness and planning?

David

I would second yor comments, David, on understanding and making more use of peripheral vision. Almost a must for establishing lateral positioning of the car so the centre of eyes can be looking ahead, particularly in bends.

If you ever see a driver behind you who is grasping the wheel with both hands and their eyes dead ahead my advice is to pull over and let them pass

I've never taken IAM Masters but have got a Rospa Diploma and to be honest cannot see the point in having both. It'd be over egging the pudding IMO.
I'm no great fan of the IAM so am happy with that arrangement.