ADUK Archive

Kwakka Jack,


You are on an advanced driver forum... Why would you want an answer from a non advanced driver point of view?


I am more than willing to give all the help and assistance I can, but when you create a problem/change a scenario from a not very well written book and expect a non expert answer, I wonder if you have missed the boat.



What should occur in that scenario is You are V3 in Lane 3... at 70MPH... Looking as far ahead as you can see, looking for other potential hazards ahead of the slow moving van/HGV in lane 1. watching closely what develops between V1 and V2 driving abreast and at the same speed with V1 on a closing gap with the HGV, taking no avoiding action like slowing down then pulling out behind V2 to avoid a collision etc...

You should be checking your mirrors to see if there is anything coming up behind you which might require you to change your plan... Covering the Horn and Headlamp flasher, as you pass the slower vehicles in the inside lanes and, when safely past, move back to lane 1 unless, there is a further hazard ahead which would prevent you from returning to the left...

Then you can think, when safely past, what on earth were those two bulkheads doing back there... why don't they look further along the road, observe and anticipate what will happen and then take the necessary action to avoid being caught up in a potentially dangerous situation... just like I have done...




And before someone says 'but you have been in a line three abreast', the system IS flexible, the differential of speeds would mean you were along side for a very very short period of time.

After all, where is the safer place to be? Ahead of a hazard behind you, or driving more slowly, possibly putting yourself into conflict with V1 and V2 and getting into a possible conflict with other vehicles approaching from the rear, because you are not traveling at the national speed limit in the outside lane of the motorway?

FF

I think perhaps John's illustrator let him down a bit with the picture - I think probably the juxtaposition of the amber and blue cars was probably not intended to be that close.

(just picked up my copy of JL (that I last read any of about a month ago) and my bookmark was actually IN that page - how spooky is that?! )

Just realised that V3 is travelling at 70mph.

FlyingFin wrote:a scenario from a not very well written book

We've seen that you don't find the illustrations helpful; but I wonder which bits of John's book you feel are useful for all us learners?

David

FlyingFin wrote:Kwakka Jack,


You are on an advanced driver forum... Why would you want an answer from a non advanced driver point of view?


I am more than willing to give all the help and assistance I can, but when you create a problem/change a scenario from a not very well written book and expect a non expert answer, I wonder if you have missed the boat.



What should occur in that scenario is You are V3 in Lane 3... at 70MPH... Looking as far ahead as you can see, looking for other potential hazards ahead of the slow moving van/HGV in lane 1. watching closely what develops between V1 and V2 driving abreast and at the same speed with V1 on a closing gap with the HGV, taking no avoiding action like slowing down then pulling out behind V2 to avoid a collision etc...

You should be checking your mirrors to see if there is anything coming up behind you which might require you to change your plan... Covering the Horn and Headlamp flasher, as you pass the slower vehicles in the inside lanes and, when safely past, move back to lane 1 unless, there is a further hazard ahead which would prevent you from returning to the left...

Then you can think, when safely past, what on earth were those two bulkheads doing back there... why don't they look further along the road, observe and anticipate what will happen and then take the necessary action to avoid being caught up in a potentially dangerous situation... just like I have done...




And before someone says 'but you have been in a line three abreast', the system IS flexible, the differential of speeds would mean you were along side for a very very short period of time.

After all, where is the safer place to be? Ahead of a hazard behind you, or driving more slowly, possibly putting yourself into conflict with V1 and V2 and getting into a possible conflict with other vehicles approaching from the rear, because you are not traveling at the national speed limit in the outside lane of the motorway?

FF

Nowt to disagree with in that, apart from the reality that, on a busy motorway, to be in the outside lane at an indicated 70mph would likely mean one impatient very close behind.
I do suspect though, that the scenario outlined would present no problem to most of those here, whichever approach they decided to use .
Examiners for different organisations might have preferences though.
There is here, in my view, a tendency to over analyse.

I was V1 this morning.

Interesting that no-one has mentioned the white van pulling out into lane 2 -- which is what happened.

FlyingFin wrote:Kwakka Jack,
What should occur in that scenario is You are V3 in Lane 3... at 70MPH...

I thought that is what the illustration was all about - don't dawdle in lane 3 at 60mph when you can safely toddle along at 70mph, because you could be stirring up all sorts of problems for yourself - I mean look at the effect it had on here

Regards
Brian Haddon

BH

My point exactly! Why is the vehicle in lane 3, traveling so slowly?


MGF,

Look at my post again,

I said ''What should occur in that scenario is You are V3 in Lane 3... at 70MPH... Looking as far ahead as you can see.....''

70 MPH is a 14MPH differential in speed over V's 1 and 2... which equates to 6.2m per second...

Average length of a car on UK roads, 5m...

Time along side V2, less than one second...

Now, I don't know about you, but I would say that less than a second was a very very short period of time.


It has become obvious that I, and a few others on the forum who can pass on our knowledge and expertise, are wasting our time. All some of you want to do is cause an argument; even-though you don't either read the post thoroughly or do your homework before posting or in some cases, move the goal posts... all for the sake of having an argument...

You''ll need to do more to convince of your expertise than self-serving statements about how much better you are than the rest of us. The general approach on this forum is to exchange experiences and views - on driving that it is rather than people who post here.

MGF,

Take a little more water with it... Your post might make sense then.


I will leave you to your uninformed twaddle, self praising and ever changing scenarios with argumentative rhetoric.


Nice to see though, you do recognize that some of us are experts, but it's a shame YOU wont listen and look beyond the end of your bonnet. YOU will remain an amateur and get caught up in daft situations that you create and then debate who has right of way... unless you listen to the experts and inwardly digest.


And it isn't my opinion that I have a certain expertise in driving matters, it is that of the Government, Her Majesties Courts Service, the IAM, RoSPA, etc. etc etc...




I have more pressing things to do than listen to any more of your drivel.


If anyone is genuinely interested in learning and would like some advise backed up with a rather large dollop of expertise, PM me, I will always try and help.


I wont waste my time with narrow minded fools.

FlyingFin wrote:MGF,

Take a little more water with it... Your post might make sense then.


I will leave you to your uninformed twaddle, self praising and ever changing scenarios with argumentative rhetoric.


Nice to see though, you do recognize that some of us are experts, but it's a shame YOU wont listen and look beyond the end of your bonnet. YOU will remain an amateur and get caught up in daft situations that you create and then debate who has right of way... unless you listen to the experts and inwardly digest.


And it isn't my opinion that I have a certain expertise in driving matters, it is that of the Government, Her Majesties Courts Service, the IAM, RoSPA, etc. etc etc...




I have more pressing things to do than listen to any more of your drivel.


If anyone is genuinely interested in learning and would like some advise backed up with a rather large dollop of expertise, PM me, I will always try and help.


I wont waste my time with narrow minded fools.

Who didn't see that coming then?

IanB wrote:Who didn't see that coming then?

Obvious troll is obvious?

FlyingFin wrote:...I wont waste my time with narrow minded fools.

Charming person.

Now, can we get back to adult conversation about all things 'advanced'?

BGOL anyone?

Post deleted.

7db wrote:

IanB wrote:Who didn't see that coming then?

Obvious troll is obvious?

I'm not so sure - I wonder if it's a combination of a mismatch between expectation and reality resulting in frustrated striking out, and an unfamiliarity with online forum interaction where most of the subtle clues of face to face conversation are missing, making it all too easy to read harsh criticism and vitriol where none (or only a little) was intended.