Progressive Driving

[Tosh]

I've recently joined this forum and have an interest in advanced driving and one thing that I've noticed is that although the IAM and RoSPA look for progressive driving I've yet to see it be taught effectively to those wishing to become an Advanced Driver. I felt that there was a distinct lack of oomph! to the driving and I would like to share some hints and tips I have picked up along the way, they are affiliated to no group but just my own experience so some of you may shudder and some may embrace... I'm not saying that you should drive like this on every journey but if you need to be somewhere quick this may help.

Roundabouts.
First of all, taking the shortest path through a roundabout, if the conditions allow for it then you are not contravening any traffic laws. Use your judgement.

The Northern Ireland edition of the Highway Code has it plain and simple:

Traffic regulations are the same in Northern Ireland as GB.

A little more on Roundabouts:

On approach to the roundabout, keep and eye on the vehicle in front and the traffic in circuit and on approach. Wait for the brake lights of the vehicle in front and delay your braking moving from the Two Second gap (Follow Position) to the Tyres and Tarmac gap (Contact Position). Your aim is to get out in the same gap as the vehicle in front. (Information, Position, Speed)

Maintain that distance and be ready to go but always be prepared to brake hard if the car in front stops suddenly. Plan - Always think - "What if" Never take your eye off the back of that car, You'll see the back dip just before it moves, that's your key to move. (Gear, Acceleration)

If the gap isn't big enough but the one behind the next vehicle in circuit is, then keep the momentum and aim to be over the line as soon as the middle of the car passes you, that way you'll have the momentum to slot in seamlessly, continue at a brisk pace to deter those waiting from cutting in front of you then and exit swiftly. (Information, Position, Acceleration)

If there are no vehicles in front of you on approach then simply adjust your speed and slot in. Just always be thinking two seconds ahead. As I said before, If there is a gap behind a vehicle in circuit then you start to move as soon as they begin to pass you. That gap is now where your vehicle is.

Making progress on the road - Urban

The main thing you can do to maintain progress on the road is to maintain progress. You are not looking to gain progress as there is little to be gained in areas below the NSL. What you are aiming to do is keep those from getting out in front of you and hindering and it's as simple as the two second rule.
When you leave a junction or roundabout for example your aim is to get within two seconds of the car up ahead so that's where a good burst of firm acceleration is useful.

Once you are in the Follow Position you are close enough that will deter those with their nose hanging out over the line at a side road or filling station from jumping in front of you (I guarantee they'll be out right behind you) but are in a safe enough position back to deal with the unexpected ahead. Again, be prepared to drop from the Follow to the Contact Position and be ready to go as soon as the traffic moves.

[martine]

Errr - thanks for that Tosh...can I ask for a little about your experience of advanced driving and training above the DSA level?

[Tosh]

Errr - thanks for that Tosh...can I ask for a little about your experience of advanced driving and training above the DSA level?

RoSPA Gold Martin.

[gannet]

Errr - thanks for that Tosh...can I ask for a little about your experience of advanced driving and training above the DSA level?

RoSPA Gold Martin.

oh

seems to me that the techniques you are describing are quite reliant on other people's reactions and co-operation, not to mention understanding of what you are doing. Not something I would want to be reliant on.

[Tosh]

Errr - thanks for that Tosh...can I ask for a little about your experience of advanced driving and training above the DSA level?

RoSPA Gold Martin.

oh

seems to me that the techniques you are describing are quite reliant on other people's reactions and co-operation, not to mention understanding of what you are doing. Not something I would want to be reliant on.

Can you show me where my techniques are reliant on other peoples reactions and co-operation as I can assure you that is very much not the case. I would not want to ever be reliant on anyone else to determine the outcome of my driving.

[gannet]

RoSPA Gold Martin.

oh

seems to me that the techniques you are describing are quite reliant on other people's reactions and co-operation, not to mention understanding of what you are doing. Not something I would want to be reliant on.

Can you show me where my techniques are reliant on other peoples reactions and co-operation as I can assure you that is very much not the case. I would not want to ever be reliant on anyone else to determine the outcome of my driving.

Bold bit - good, glad to hear it

Wait for the brake lights of the vehicle in front and delay your braking moving from the Two Second gap (Follow Position) to the Tyres and Tarmac gap (Contact Position). Your aim is to get out in the same gap as the vehicle in front. (Information, Position, Speed)

Maintain that distance and be ready to go but always be prepared to brake hard if the car in front stops suddenly. Plan - Always think - "What if" Never take your eye off the back of that car, You'll see the back dip just before it moves, that's your key to move. (Gear, Acceleration)

If the gap isn't big enough but the one behind the next vehicle in circuit is, then keep the momentum and aim to be over the line as soon as the middle of the car passes you, that way you'll have the momentum to slot in seamlessly, continue at a brisk pace to deter those waiting from cutting in front of you then and exit swiftly. (Information, Position, Acceleration)

Just this whole section really - My eyes need to be on more than just the back of the car in front. You are also aiming for the same gap as the vehicle in front goes for - what if they slow as they enter the roundabout? what if the gap closes as you follow him out?

Even aiming for the gap behind by keeping momentum, look at that from the point of view of the car on the roundabout - they may misread your momentum as you trying to get out in front of them and then do something unpredictable.

I may of course have misread and it is difficult to put such things into writing.

It is far better to drive your own drive making progress where possible without affecting others as best as you can. This is not always possible and we all make mistakes...

[martine]

Errr - thanks for that Tosh...can I ask for a little about your experience of advanced driving and training above the DSA level?

RoSPA Gold Martin.

OK reason I ask is because the bits you quote don't seem to be very 'advanced' in my view. Many of the drivers here on ADUK would be well aware of the techniques you describe...'eggs', 'suck' and 'grandmother' are words that spring to mind. Apologies if that seems a little 'short' and I don't mean you to take offence but quoting large amounts of text from the Highway Code comes across as a 'lecturing' style rather than a discussion.

For me being progressive in town is about lane selection, timing of approach to traffic lights and roundabouts and keeping the wheels moving as much as reasonably possible - not closing up to 2 second gaps or straight-lining as I think you advocated. Progress on rural roads is quite different of course.

[Tosh]

Wait for the brake lights of the vehicle in front and delay your braking moving from the Two Second gap (Follow Position) to the Tyres and Tarmac gap (Contact Position). Your aim is to get out in the same gap as the vehicle in front. (Information, Position, Speed)

Maintain that distance and be ready to go but always be prepared to brake hard if the car in front stops suddenly. Plan - Always think - "What if" Never take your eye off the back of that car, You'll see the back dip just before it moves, that's your key to move. (Gear, Acceleration)

If the gap isn't big enough but the one behind the next vehicle in circuit is, then keep the momentum and aim to be over the line as soon as the middle of the car passes you, that way you'll have the momentum to slot in seamlessly, continue at a brisk pace to deter those waiting from cutting in front of you then and exit swiftly. (Information, Position, Acceleration)

Just this whole section really - My eyes need to be on more than just the back of the car in front. You are also aiming for the same gap as the vehicle in front goes for - what if they slow as they enter the roundabout? what if the gap closes as you follow him out?

Even aiming for the gap behind by keeping momentum, look at that from the point of view of the car on the roundabout - they may misread your momentum as you trying to get out in front of them and then do something unpredictable.

I may of course have misread and it is difficult to put such things into writing.

It is far better to drive your own drive making progress where possible without affecting others as best as you can. This is not always possible and we all make mistakes...

When I say not to take your eye off the back off the car what I mean is to use your peripheral vision and keep it under constant observation at the same time as judging the gap that you are going to move into. Splitting your vision if you like.

If I'm under any concern about not being able to move seamlessly into the gap safely then I don't go. My emphasis about following the lead vehicle is that the first available opportunity is not missed but chances are not taken.

I understand what you mean about the momentum being misread by the vehicle in circuit but that is where careful judgement is applied to time the approach speed to that of the vehicle in circuit making it clear that my intention is for entry after and not before them. Eye contact with the driver does help but in many cases the other drivers are completely oblivious. The approach speed is very low and timed to be seamless.

I hope this clarifies the points I was making.

[Tosh]

Errr - thanks for that Tosh...can I ask for a little about your experience of advanced driving and training above the DSA level?

RoSPA Gold Martin.

OK reason I ask is because the bits you quote don't seem to be very 'advanced' in my view. Many of the drivers here on ADUK would be well aware of the techniques you describe...'eggs', 'suck' and 'grandmother' are words that spring to mind. Apologies if that seems a little 'short' and I don't mean you to take offence but quoting large amounts of text from the Highway Code comes across as a 'lecturing' style rather than a discussion.

For me being progressive in town is about lane selection, timing of approach to traffic lights and roundabouts and keeping the wheels moving as much as reasonably possible - not closing up to 2 second gaps or straight-lining as I think you advocated. Progress on rural roads is quite different of course.

The quote from the Highway Code was to highlight the difference in the Great Britain and the Northern Ireland Edition. That appendix on Roundabouts does not feature in the GB edition. The second paragraph about taking the shortest and most convenient route. I have amended my op to reflect this. Apologies if it came across as lecturing and condescending as that very much was not intended.

I agree fully that to remain progressive on the roads in an urban setting relies on lane selection and making smooth approaches to junctions and traffic lights in order to maintain momentum. That is a given for advanced driving. I was just trying to give other examples as to where progression can be made safely if needs must. I find it is useful to adopt these techniques if making progress is a factor in my driving. If it falls in the "advanced" category or not, I'm sure it doesn't as it's not explicitly written in the hallowed scriptures of Roadcraft

[martine]

OK thanks Tosh for clarifying that. I have to say I don't deliberately close up to a 2 second gap quickly in urban driving to make good progress...I really can't get excited about an occasional vehicle taking the gap - in fact sometimes I encourage it. In the scale of things I think lane selection has a much bigger affect on progress but each to their own.

For me, urban driving is more about restraint, 'team-playing' and the occasional 'progressive' lane selection. Rural driving is for me more about progress...limit point analysis, early acceleration in a bend and taking overtaking opportunities, all contribute.

[Tosh]

Thanks Martin, I too when I'm in my own car drive very much to a pace much more relaxed and am happy to ease back off the go pedal and let someone be on their way.

There are times when we must be somewhere as a matter of urgency and that is where those techniques are employed. As Vonhosen would say, it's just another tool in the box for you to use. If they are practiced and refined then they can be used and the drive is still imperceptible for those you may be transporting. They will never be aware of the urgency of your drive.

It can factor into other areas where you may be in convoy or just simply following someone in traffic. Its all to easy to become separated. So they're probably a bit impractical for the trip to Tesco but for some they could be a useful addition to their driver training. Every little helps!

[martine]

Thanks Martin, I too when I'm in my own car drive very much to a pace much more relaxed and am happy to ease back off the go pedal and let someone be on their way.

There are times when we must be somewhere as a matter of urgency and that is where those techniques are employed.

I take it your'e police?

[Tosh]

Thanks Martin, I too when I'm in my own car drive very much to a pace much more relaxed and am happy to ease back off the go pedal and let someone be on their way.

There are times when we must be somewhere as a matter of urgency and that is where those techniques are employed.

I take it your'e police?

No I'm very much just a member of the public so I have to adhere to all regulations wherever I may be. I sadly don't get the benefit of brightly marked vehicles with strobes and sirens to assist me through traffic. That's too easy! Being able to move at a rapid pace without drawing attention is very much an aspect of my work.

For instance, where Roadcraft would advise that firm acceleration is taken in a low gear and then dropped to a high gear I would do almost the reverse as high revs mean noise. When exiting a roundabout or junction and a bit of go is needed to "hook" the vehicle ahead of you to the Following Position I would drop to the highest usable gear and use the engine torque to pull from low revs. This will still result in firm but almost imperceptible acceleration. Again, many would say that is not an advanced technique not espoused by the fraternity but for some it may be something they could find useful in their drive.

[daz6215]

Thanks Martin, I too when I'm in my own car drive very much to a pace much more relaxed and am happy to ease back off the go pedal and let someone be on their way.

There are times when we must be somewhere as a matter of urgency and that is where those techniques are employed.

I take it your'e police?

I sadly don't get the benefit of brightly marked vehicles with strobes and sirens to assist me through traffic. That's too easy! .

Thats why unmarked vehicles are used on courses.

[michael769]

I am puzzled by the reluctance to use high revs. Unless the car is modified to be unenecessarily noisy, other drivers don't really hear the engine noise of other vehicles from inside their cars so unless there is a concern around pedestrians and cyclists hering the revs (and that would only be a concern on quiet roads as road noise will make it unnoticable in heavy traffic conditions.

Unless of course you are driving a heavy that is.

I am also rather bemused by the comment "firm but almost imperceptable acceleration". Surely firm and almost imperceptable and at different ends of the acceleration range from the media and thus mutually exclusive.