Pre-drive Checks.

[Silk]

What a complete and utter waste of time and effort.

IMO, of course.

[WhoseGeneration]

What a complete and utter waste of time and effort.

IMO, of course.

Nope, over hangover but coffee mug in cupholder just to provide that caffeine buzz, satnav on windscreen right in front of me, phone or tablet all charged and ready to go. All the necessary checked.

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

Bored again, Steve?

If someone gets in my car who's not driven it before, or a car that's new to both of us and doesn't do at least basic checks, when I'm sat in the passenger seat, I get twitchy. How often do you drive an unfamiliar car, perhaps belonging to somebody else? That's when the pre-drive checks come into their own, making sure:

• you're safe, comfortable and in control - the car is safely parked, you can reach the pedals, see properly in the mirrors etc.
• you know where everything is - so you can find it quickly when you need to.
• it's all working - no warning lights, gauges reading sensible values etc.
• you have the "feel" of the controls

What's wasted about any of that? Discuss ...

[WhoseGeneration]

www.iam-bristol.org.uk/index.php?option ... 9&Itemid=1

Those of us with more knowledge would, I hope, go even further.
In that regular checks but needing access to jacks etc, would reveal potential problems.

[waremark]

What a complete and utter waste of time and effort.

IMO, of course.

Do you feel the same if you get into a hire car, or someone else drives your car?

Does anyone share your car? Would you adjust seat and mirrors before setting off? How do you feel if someone driving you starts adjusting the seat and mirrors as they are driving along? In which case of course you can be pretty sure they have not familiarised themselves with the position and operation of controls which they may need in a hurry.

[WhoseGeneration]

It's a 10/10 from me for the OP.
A new thread to at least try to get some discussion going on a 'site that appears to be slowly slipping into oblivion.

[TripleS]

What Mr C-W says makes sense, but I thought Steve was referring to getting into one's own car and doing the checks every time. That, to me, would seem unnecessary. Getting into and driving an unfamiliar car is a different matter.

[onlinegenie]

On the subject of pre-drive checks (not whether or not they're worthwhile) what's the consensus on whether to put seat belt on before or after turning the engine on? An observer I once sat in with told the associate to turn the engine on before putting seat belt on, the idea being that if it burst into flames there would be more time to get out of the car. My opinion is that, in the extremely unlikely event of an engine bursting into flames, there would be enough time for me to take off my seat belt and get out of the car before the flames reached the inside of the car.

I posted the question the Advanced Driving Magazine's Q&A but they didn't publish it.

[JamesAllport]

Having read the OP just before I was about to go out and drive I thought I'd notice what I actually do. It turns out that in my own car I:

(1) Walk to the drivers door the long way around the car to notice whether the tyres look grossly wrong.
(2) Check that I've shut the door firmly and then immediately check the handbrake is on firmly (my drive way slopes).
(3) Fiddle with the seat and mirrors because my wife was the last person to drive. HPC members will know that this can extend the process considerably as one starts a discussion about exactly how to sit...
(4) Turn off the auxilliaries my wife left switched on - today the fan.
(5) Check neutral, pump the brake pedal to get a solid pedal, depress clutch, ignition on.
(6) Start engine. Check fuel and no weird lights on. Check brake pedal softens with the servo effect.
(7) Fasten seatbelt. Take a moment to make sure the lap belt is over my pelvis not my tummy.
(8) Good look around, remind myself to start gently and slowly, and move away.

Today, total time elapsed about 30 seconds and, I'd argue, every element adds value.

[TripleS]

What Mr C-W says makes sense, but I thought Steve was referring to getting into one's own car and doing the checks every time. That, to me, would seem unnecessary. Getting into and driving an unfamiliar car is a different matter.

A full cockpit drill in your own car, every time, may well be excessive but are you seriously saying that you don't do any pre-drive checks, at all? ... which is what Silk said.

First drive of the day...

1. Walk around the car
- are all the tyres inflated and free from sidewall damage?
- are all the lights clean and undamaged?
- any other vehicle damage?
- are the windows clean?

2. Inside
- handbrake and neutral !!
- were you the last to drive it? do seats and mirrors need adjusting?
- all doors shut and passengers (if any) belted?
- switch on
- all lights that should be on ... on?
- all lights that should go out ... out?
- sufficient fuel for journey?

and so on ...

Silk's statement was quite obviously provocative and a complete nonsense.

Provocative? Yes, I guess so. A complete nonsense? No, not a complete nonsense.

For my own part I do check most of the items you mention, but only by casual observation, rather than making it a formal and systematic checking procedure.

If Steve's view is that we sometime make an unnecessarily big deal of things around here, I'd say he could be right about that.

[trashbat]

I check the oil every once in a while, because sometimes it uses plenty, and sometimes none, in unfathomable patterns, and you really don't want to run it low.

I also thought the rolling brake check was a waste of time until I bought a pressure washer, whereupon I discovered that it takes a fair few car lengths to recover braking after a good clean.

[Silk]

What Mr C-W says makes sense, but I thought Steve was referring to getting into one's own car and doing the checks every time. That, to me, would seem unnecessary. Getting into and driving an unfamiliar car is a different matter.

That's what I meant. It's this tedious ritual that some people insist that you demonstrate *every* time you get in the car.

I can understand it in an "arse-covering" situation, such as driving Police cars. But is it really necessary to go through all that nonsense, such as telling the passengers how to operate the doors?

Of course I constantly check for damage, tread depth and all the other stuff and I'll familiarise myself when driving different car. I also make sure the car is safe before moving off and again when I've parked. What I don't do is more checks than a fighter pilot, just to pop to the shops.

It's just another example of something that does nothing to attract people to Advanced Driving - quite the opposite.

...and let's not get started on shutdown procedures, although I believe Mr Toad does one rather well.

[trashbat]

I'll ask the obvious question, then: who are these people that insist you demonstrate such a process?

Personally I've only ever seen IAM observers ask for it, apparently as centrally mandated by whatever programme they operate to. Do you think they should abandon it?

[Silk]

I'll ask the obvious question, then: who are these people that insist you demonstrate such a process?

Personally I've only ever seen IAM observers ask for it, apparently as centrally mandated by whatever programme they operate to. Do you think they should abandon it?

I believe they should abandon it. My impression is, a lot of the examiners would like to get on the drive, rather than sitting through 10 minutes of tedium beforehand.

I'd also extend it to manoeuvres. They should have been covered on the basic L test.

[TheInsanity1234]

I check the oil every once in a while, because sometimes it uses plenty, and sometimes none, in unfathomable patterns

It's an Alfa Romeo, what do you expect?

Personally, I don't think you should need to do those in-depth checks more than once a week, and the casual checks you should do at least once a day. I mean, there's no need to make sure that your mirrors and the chair, etc are all properly adjusted, especially if you're the only one driving the car or you know for sure you were the last person to use that car.