How long to give the "ditherer"?

[jont]

On the way home this evening I came across an interesting situation...
I caught up a queue behind a tractor. There were 2 cars behind the tractor, then me. They had been prevented from overtaking by oncoming traffic, but once that cleared there was a rather long cross view (Soham-Stretham road for those local, between Soham and Wicken)
The first car went, and I set myself up, expecting car 2 to follow through and leave me to go too while the view continued to remain clear.

Car 2 hesitated for a few seconds, so as I'd moved out (holding position), I decided that I'd take both car and tractor. Car 2 started to indicate to come out just as I passed them, although didn't move my way, so I think they had realised/heard I was there.

So... should I have waited even longer? Used a warning (I didn't use either horn or lights)?

But how long do you wait? I know it's never wrong to miss the overtake, but if someone wants to spend all day behind a tractor isn't that their perogative? In this case I probably could have waited longer, but often if you don't get on with the overtake, the opportunity is lost for some time.

[TheInsanity1234]

In my view, I would've left it for about 30 seconds, then if they didn't overtake, I would start indicating, switch my lights (dipped beam) on, so I would stand out in their mirror, then if the road is still clear, I'll make my move.

I'd like to hear what others would do.

[michael769]

Generally I would wait as long as I felt was necessary to satisfy myself they were not taking an opportunity to pass, usually body language can tell you all you need to know.

It may well be that your overtake woke up car 2, and prompted them to follow through. Did they give any indication of angst at your move?

[jont]

Did they give any indication of angst at your move?

Nothing that I was around long enough to see

[TripleS]

I wouldn't wait very long - maybe a few seconds, no more: then if it was clear I would go, but be ready to give a warning toot if they started to make a move that would conflict with my overtake.

30 seconds is a very long time: I wouldn't wait that long.

[7db]

Out. Pause. Check. Go.

[fungus]

Thirty seconds at 20mph, that's 298yds. Sorry, I still use imperial measurements.

Out. Pause. Check. Go.

+ 1

[swatchways]

(Soham-Stretham road for those local, between Soham and Wicken)

Slightly O/T - It seems you're very local, how have I missed that before? Would be good to meet up for a drive some time if you've time/inclination, always looking for more people to drive with locally!

[waremark]

Out. Pause. Check. Go.

Out. Pause. Warning. Check. Go.

I would only use the indicator on rare occasions, for the driver behind.

My cars have daylight running lights.

[jont]

Thanks for everyones thoughts. I think I'd have no hesitation about "Out. Pause. Check. Go." for a normal multi vehicle overtake. My main reservation with this one was that with the lead vehicle being a tractor, you would expect most drivers to be looking for an overtake at some point rather than happy sat behind it.

Ah well, roads being what they are around here I'm sure I'll get some more practice in the next couple of days (certainly on my Bristol commute I'd never have the chance to look for half a dozen overtakes on the way home!)

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

how have I missed that before?

He only moved recently... your gain is my loss.

[TR4ffic]

Not much to add really.

The problem with ditherers (in any situation) is that the longer you wait to see what they're going to do the more time you give them to make up their minds to actually do something (or not) - It can turn into a viscous circle of mutual indecisiveness. Additionally, they are displaying poor planning and judgement and, you must presume, poor observation so are they are unlikely to be taking note of what’s happening behind them…

[jont]

3. How 'buried' was the second vehicle? If they're so close that they can't see that it's safe to move out and they haven't seen you move out, then they aren't coming out.

Not buried at all. Although it was a little low powered thing (Smart) - but even that at tractor pace (and with the space available along there) shouldn't have had any issues overtaking - indeed it had enough time to come through with another car as I was disappearing off into the distance.

[trashbat]

For all the planning and extrapolation, there can always be a surprise.

I posted a while back about an overtake of mine that went wrong, fortunately without damage.

The second car behind the tractor (with the first staying put), a Renault Clio driven by an ~80 year old woman, went for the overtake as I was overtaking the longer line, and alongside her.

It probably wasn't what the first thing I would have expected in a paper planning exercise.

As regards the OP, I think you introduced doubt by hanging out in the overtaking position, although the assumption relies on them having seen you. If I'd been in Car 2, I would have favoured staying put, probably based on some quick judgement about whether I could out-accelerate you.

[TheInsanity1234]

To be frank, I doubt there is a set process you can follow unless it's a bare minimum process as every situation will be different and will demand a different adaptation of the basic process, so I guess

"Out. Pause. Check. Go."

is your best bet