Advice on dangerous over taking situation

[kitkatbrown]

Hello, i wondered if someone who has undertaken the advanced driving course could advise on what the advanced driving course teaches as regards dealing with cars overtaking in dangerous places. On a single carriage way road, speed limit 60 miles per hour. What should you do if you find someone on the wrong side of the road, coming towards you. It would happen perhaps if they only had a short stretch within which they can complete the manouver, can't pull back in and have basically mis-guaged the situation.

I use a road where drivers can't overtake easily so seem to get frustrated and just go for it. The other day I had the worst one over, the driver had overtaken on a moderate bend and was headiing towards me on the wrong side of the road. i braked to a halt and even then the other driver only just made it back in. I was in such a vulnerable and dangerous situation from both in front and behind and thought perhaps if I had done an advanced driving course I could have done something more to protect myself.

I realise I need to do an advanced course. I wondered if there was advice on how best to deal with these situation.

Any wise advice would be very welcome.

[7db]

Make space and time.

[7db]

Sorry - just saw you are new. Welcome.

Space and time are the most important things when there's danger around.

It sounds like you did pretty much the most important thing -- got on the brakes and gave the other guy a chance to recover from his screw-up without there being an incident. A bit of space once can be created once you are slowed and under control if you can do it without endangering yourself (nudge in to the nearside so that there's three abreast if needs be).

Other than that it's about anticipating when these dangers might arise and making sure that you are in a position to handle it (stop at a minimum) and help the situation out.

[triquet]

In some ways you got it right. In a situation like this sometimes the only thing to do is to stamp hard on the pedal and entrust your soul to the God of ABS. By the time you have registered the situation, considered a suitable response, selected the right gear, sounded your horn, flashed your lights and then stood on the brakes, the blighter is in your radiator and the airbag has gone off ....

[dombooth]

Brake, hard.

Welcome to the forums.

Dom

[Gareth]

Space and time are the most important things when there's danger around.

To add - I would also be holding main beam on until the situation had resolved itself.

The last thing you want is for the other driver to be so focused on what they're doing that it takes more time than necessary for them to become aware that you are in their path.

You want your presence to be the highest priority in their minds; it would be safer for them to crash into whatever it is they are overtaking -- assuming it's another vehicle -- than it would for them to be head-on into you.

Bear in mind, though, that some drivers find self-imposed danger exhilarating and will laugh in the face of your fear.

[michael769]

Make space and time.

This. Brake to reduce speed, Brake as hard as possible - if you cannot feel the ABS kicking in you are not braking hard enough, this creates more time, more space and if worst come to it reduces the consequences of a hit. Move as far to the left as possible (if your car does not have ABS don't attempt to steer whilst emergency braking). Many single carriageway roads have the physical space to accommodate 3 cars side by side even many that at first glance would be too narrow. Look for an escape route (junction,opening layby but be mindful of your speed and ability to take the escape route without a loss of control).

If you have time to scrub a lot of speed off, consider mounting the verge- a puncture or broken suspension may be less severe consequences than those of hitting an oncomer head on at speed, but only do so if you can be sure there is no ditch rock or other obstacle that could cause your vehicle to roll over, and don't do it it speed as even a kerb or the lip at the edge of the road can cause a fast moving car to roll.

Be wary of using headlamps especially in the dark as it will impact not only the overtaker but the ability of the overtakee to assist in avoiding any collision, do not allow the desire to give a warning (or rebuke) to delay your attempts to avoid the collision. Brake first warn last!

If you discover a particular road is a hotspot for such incidents consider adjusting the speed you approach and negotiate such areas - the goal is to select a speed so that you can stop well within the distance you can see to be clear and can reasonably expect to remain so.

[zadocbrown]

To add - I would also be holding main beam on until the situation had resolved itself.

Really? I'm not sure blinding an oncoming driver or indeed focussing their attention on something to hit is necessarily the best approach in this situation.

My thoughts too. If I used headlamps it would only be for long enough to announce my presence. Otherwise target fixation might kick in.

A few other points:

Actively look for this hazard and start dealing with it early. A second of delay is a long time.

Don't over-react. In the vast majority of these scenarios a full on crash stop is not needed and could cause other problems. However if it is really that critical get on the ABS immediately.

Consider your position (left or right) on the road. Both proactively to prevent danger arising and reactively to get away from it when it does threaten. Advanced training will really help with this.

[TheInsanity1234]

Apply gentle, but firm pressure on the footbrake, and maintain this pressure until you have stopped.

At the same time, open your offside window, smoothly extend your right fist out of said window. When your arm is fully stretched, extend your middle finger, and maintain for as long as the need remains.

[Gareth]

To add - I would also be holding main beam on until the situation had resolved itself.

Really? I'm not sure blinding an oncoming driver or indeed focussing their attention on something to hit is necessarily the best approach in this situation.

If I used headlamps it would only be for long enough to announce my presence. Otherwise target fixation might kick in.

I think main beam doesn't cause target fixation since target fixation requires the driver to be looking in that direction to the exclusion of everywhere else. Much more likely, I think, is that the driver will look away from the headlights, (while being very much aware of them), so they'd be more likely to steer away and/or take other avoiding action.

[triquet]

If you haven't been in this situation, don't get over-analytical or theoretical. If it happens the only realistic thing to do is to brake hard and pray. If you have ABS, sure, look for a escape route. But to do anything before braking is to eat into valuable reaction time. The other driver will be a state of utter panic as he will also know he's screwed up and may act completely randomly.

[zadocbrown]

I think main beam doesn't cause target fixation since target fixation requires the driver to be looking in that direction to the exclusion of everywhere else. Much more likely, I think, is that the driver will look away from the headlights, (while being very much aware of them), so they'd be more likely to steer away and/or take other avoiding action.

Have a look at this:

http://janheine.wordpress.com/2014/04/12/when-more-visible-%E2%89%A0-safer-target-fixation/

Couldn't immediately find anything more scholarly, but it gives the gist. There is a risk that in shining a bright light in someone's face they focus on it and therefore drive towards it.

What do you want them to focus on? Probably the gap between you and whatever they are overtaking. If there's a dazzling light to the side does that help or hinder?

[7db]

Sharks do this.

If you're on a night dive, shine your torch on someone else and watch the sharks swim directly at them.

[triquet]

Sharks do this.

If you're on a night dive, shine your torch on someone else and watch the sharks swim directly at them.

Good point, always keep a torch in the car, and check your insurance policy for shark damage.

[martine]

Sharks do this.

If you're on a night dive, shine your torch on someone else and watch the sharks swim directly at them.

Oh what a jape 7db! You tinker - I bet the others all laugh about you in the pub...not.

I can see both sides of the target fixation debate...so how about a headlamp flash to make sure the opposing driver knows you are there rather than a prolonged blast?