Nigel wrote:You could quite reasonably percive a road to be a 40 mph limit for example
How do you perceive a road to be 40 (& not 30 or 50) in the absence of any signage ?
Nigel wrote:You could quite reasonably percive a road to be a 40 mph limit for example
vonhosen wrote:Nigel wrote:You could quite reasonably percive a road to be a 40 mph limit for example
How do you perceive a road to be 40 (& not 30 or 50) in the absence of any signage ?
Gareth wrote:vonhosen wrote:Nigel wrote:You could quite reasonably percive a road to be a 40 mph limit for example
How do you perceive a road to be 40 (& not 30 or 50) in the absence of any signage ?
I assume you're playing devil's advocate here ... anyway I'd say drivers perceive appropriate speed for any situation by the concentration of lateral hazards, then would assume a speed limit roughly in line with those perceptions averaged over the stretch in question.
It's not unreasonable to expect 30 mph limits where people are likely to walking quite close to the road. Where roads are a little bit wider, and footpaths are wide and/or set back from roads, a 40 mph limit might be expected. Apart from the b******s of rural 50 mph limits, then a reasonable driver might expect that limit to apply where there is a high volume of traffic with protection such as railings to keep pedestrians separated from the road, or perhaps urban dual carriageways.
Where this falls down, as is now so often the case, is where speed limits have been lowered below that expected by a reasonable driver. Compounded by poor and/or obscured signage.
MGF wrote:I believe speed traps should give motorists every chance of getting their speed right. Surely the point of a speed trap is to detect those who willfully speed or are so careless they are unaware.
Obscuring a repeater is unhelpful even if technically acceptable.
Nigel wrote:But Von, we all make judgements all the time.
I'd suggest I'm quite capable ( as are most other people I know) of judging what is appropriate at the time I'm driving along a stretch of road.
hardboiled wrote:If you think that the great majority are capable of ascertaining a 30mph speed limit by the presence of street lamps then I think that you are massively overestimating their capabilities and/or knowledge.
They read roadsigns, sometimes, then they either choose to obey them or normally ignore them and go at the speed that they feel most comfortable with at the time be it higher or lower than the limit.
vonhosen wrote:Well I wouldn't say the point of the speed trap is to give motorists every chance of getting their speed right, I'd say it's the speed limit that should be doing that.
If the sign is obscured then it is neither helpful OR acceptable.
dreamer wrote:There are many roads around here that flick between 30/40 regularly - sometimes within half mile. Nothing obvious to indicate why; no difference in the quantity of housing, schools, pavements etc.
The signs are just on the exit from a roundabout often - obscured on your entrance/approach to the roundabout and when you're exiting they're above your head and not the easiest to see.
I sometimes find myself doing 30 hoping to see a repeater at some point with a queue of traffic behind me (as they mostly do 50 regardless of the 30/40).
Add to that the number of NSL's which are now 50 limits (with no signage to say "new speed limit", just small 50 signs) and it can be hard knowing what speed limit you are in.
Nigel wrote:dreamer wrote:There are many roads around here that flick between 30/40 regularly - sometimes within half mile. Nothing obvious to indicate why; no difference in the quantity of housing, schools, pavements etc.
The signs are just on the exit from a roundabout often - obscured on your entrance/approach to the roundabout and when you're exiting they're above your head and not the easiest to see.
I sometimes find myself doing 30 hoping to see a repeater at some point with a queue of traffic behind me (as they mostly do 50 regardless of the 30/40).
Add to that the number of NSL's which are now 50 limits (with no signage to say "new speed limit", just small 50 signs) and it can be hard knowing what speed limit you are in.
I'm with you all the way dreamer.
Add to this a high percentage of my total driving in areas I'm not familiar with....and you have an unreasonable amount of my driving effort spent trying to stay legal, looking for every single clue as to what the speed limit "may" be.
Scamera partnerships ?...scrap the lot, lets get back to promoting safer driving.
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